Thompson center icon issues

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by linksmechanic, Sep 20, 2009.

  1. linksmechanic

    linksmechanic Well-Known Member

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    I bought a brand new icon the other day in .308 for about $500.00. Loaded some rounds: Lapua brass, berger 155 vlds and match 210 primers over 46.5 grains of varget. My first 5 round group was around 1/2 an inch. After that stuff started going haywire. I've been shooting and loading for a long time but wanted to get some input from someone on here. I was getting fliers all over the place. Sometimes 3 inches high and to the right and then it would shoot a cloverleaf and the same thing would happen again later. I should have stopped and saved my ammo but I was super frusturated. I have a vx3 on it and I'm wondering of the scope is the issue. Never had a prob. with a leupold but there is a first for everything right? I was wondering if any of you have had this bad of fliers with a copper fouled barrel? Personally I haven't and have never had a scope issuer either so this is kind of new to me. Everything is nice and tight so I will probably swap the scope out tomorrow and try her again. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks.
     
  2. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Did you break in you barrel or clean it while you were shooting? I bought TC ICON PH in .308 few weeks back, I was at the range today it shot 0.3” groups, but last week I had 0.15” average, did you check you seating depth on your handloads? Do you know your MAX OAL? If you still have issues I can give you an e-mail address of TC customer service rep I worked previously, since they have very tight specs on their riffles I thought I might have head space issue so the customer service rep overnight my rifle back to the factory they checked everything came out fine they overnight it back to me next day, if you think something wrong with your riffle they will be gladly take a look at it. I even ask to retest accuracy on it since my certificate stated 0.8 and I was shooting 0.3” groups with 168 SMK. So they did and new certificated stated 0.54”
    By the way did you get $150 rebate on yours?

    About fliers, I did have some you described when I decide to test H4895 powder and I used RL 15 before, for some reasons it didn’t like H4895 I had flier in almost every group, say 300 yards 2 shots almost touching and a flier 2 - 3” high, when I switched back to RL 15, 0.9” groups. Try different powder different bullet, I found that my likes 168 – 155 grain SMK or 168 – 155 NCC and 42.6 grain of RL 15 and OAL for 155gr 2.785” and for 168gr 2.815” OAL

    By the way with Varget on 155 grain bullets do not exceed 44.8 - 44.9 grains, I know Hodgon lists 47 grains max and 44 as starting, but in reality you can start with 41.5 grains and work your load up, the 44.8 grain load should propel 155 grain projectile with aprox 2800 fps, and accuracy load for 155 grain is 2700 fps
    If you check Hodgons’s Match Loads they don’t include Varget as recommended powder.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2009

  3. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Read this article about copper fouling, try to clean it and break in you barrel

    RSI - Copper Fouling
     
  4. linksmechanic

    linksmechanic Well-Known Member

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    Some more input would be greatly appreciated.
     
  5. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    Did you swap scopes and retry the groups?

    Does the flier occur as the barrel heats or can it be on cold bore shots?

    Is the stock bedded?

    Are you sure you are rest in the bags the same each shot?

    Do you have chrono data for your shooting?

    Try a different bullet and see if you get the same problem. VLD's can be problematic!

    Are you putting these in the rifle one at a time or feeding through magazine? If you are feeding through the magazine recoil could be changing OAL. VLD's don't like that.
     
  6. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    Any new news on this ICON?
     
  7. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    I guess he is busy getting that copper fouling out… I would recommend to use KG-12 but if its very bad JB can do miracles :D
     
  8. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    Jinx. If the fouling is that bad, he should try some of Tubb's final finish and lap the barrel. Maybe he will come back and tell us what is going on. I have more than enough rifles right now, but if I were buying a factory rifle I would consider the ICON. I would like to know the outcome here!
     
  9. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    I thought that after the initial break in I should not clean in it for at least 100 shots, well I was wrong, I start to get those fliers probably on the 20 – 30 shot I made, so I cleaned it and as soon as I did it start making one hole groups, by the way TC doesn't recommend ammonia based solvents, the Tubbs finish… Hmm never tried it, could be another miracle bullet. :D
     
  10. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Got back from the range today, the wind was terrible and I had inconsistent groups all day, one group measured 0.8” at 300 yards and the worse was like 4.25 don’t know what to say… then at 100 yards best group was 0.28 and worse 1.2”, and what amazes me is that my new brass which I only full size it did better then the one I been neck sizing at least 4 – 6 times… maybe its time to throw old brass away or try to full size it… or maybe it just the cross wind, I didn’t have any flags setup I was looking at the trees and bushes for wind direction and it was blowing to the right at 100 and somewhere passed 200 to the left, weird, but I noticed it by how leaves are flying from the trees, anyway even 4.25” group at 300 yards will be more then enough and when I hunt I don’t shoot groups :D
     
  11. linksmechanic

    linksmechanic Well-Known Member

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    I will get back with you guys when I get to the range. It's packed right now because it's almost rifle season here so I plan on going on some Nf land tomorrow to shoot the rifle again. It's a beautiful rifle and more than well made. Just worring about how it shoots.
     
  12. linksmechanic

    linksmechanic Well-Known Member

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    Went to the range today with 50 rounds loaded. Clean barrel, different scope. This thing gets hot fast so there is alot of waiting inbetween shooting(should have brought more than one gun). After the intial site-in I started shooting for groups. The first 2 were in the same hole then the 3rd was off at least an inch. This thing is all over the place. I really believe it just get's hot really fast and after that it's done. I shoot all heavy barrel guns and this is only the third light barrel gun I've owned but if you can't shoot 20 rounds down it in an hour I don't want it! I let it cool several times and it seems to tighten up after it cools down. I also tried some factory federal gold metal match ammo and it seemed to do the same thing. I think I'm done with it. I have several .308's and I don't need one that doesn't shoot.
     
  13. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    You may be able to salvage the rifle with bedding the stock, but you sound like you may not want to go to effort for this one.

    My question is: were the first shots out of the cool barrel in the same place?

    Thanks, for the update!
     
  14. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    I see, my TC in .308 comes with heavy barrel and I don’t have this overheating issue you do… Good luck, usually light barrel rifles are not for group shooting, they are more like one shot deal, two at most.