TDS & B&C reticle drop values?
- Thread starter drpbroun5
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I shoot a TDS, but so far only to 500 yards. The swarovski web site is real close on the numbers, however that is only a starting point. Nothing takes the place of bench time with your rifle & load. I feel very confident to 500 yds with my TDS. I shoot a 300 rum with 180's.
I have decided that a nightforce will be bought before next season. I will try to use the reticle like a tds to the 500 yd line (that is the max for me shooting at something with hair) past 500 to 800 I will click. I said this is my plan & will be my first time to spin turrets.
I have decided that a nightforce will be bought before next season. I will try to use the reticle like a tds to the 500 yd line (that is the max for me shooting at something with hair) past 500 to 800 I will click. I said this is my plan & will be my first time to spin turrets.
I have used the TDS for 3 yrs on a 300 Hart killing deer to over 600 and coyotes out to almost 900. This year I put a kahles 3-9 TDS on a 300 WSM and took deer at 467. Not exactly long, but mine is accurate to 700 based on my numbers in a program and actual testing. Before that I had used the B&C on the Hart. I do not care for the B &C, the TDS is really slick and works with a little work.
However, the key with the B&C and TDS is to find the exact distance in inches between stadias at a couple powers. You can call the company and they will give it to you. That way all you need is a ballistic program to run the numbers on MV (you will need that), altitude etc and a small 3x5 card will put you on. I have numbers for my 3-9 at 6x and 9x. That way you are not limited to one power as mentioned. Just have to be smarter than the simple instructions.
No they are not suited more much over 600 normally but they are relatively inexpensive (the Kahles 3-9 was $450 used and the Swarovski 6-18 was $800 used.) Their glass is second to none. A PDA will sell for under $100, a chrono for under $200 and exbal is under $50. Not much else is needed for their practical distances.
clicking is nice and essential IF it is long range and you have the time to look at the multiple drop charts, input data after multiple readings etc. I know I do that also. However, more shots are presented real world at 600 and under normally than over. The TDS is fast and reliable in that scenario.
Do not discount them because you do not have a $1000 scope and $2000 worth of computers and wind meters, etc.
Will give you a little hint, same system I mentioned above will work with the Burris B-Plex and the new Nikon Omegas and BDS reticles. All you need is the inches at a couple powers and a PDA.
BH
However, the key with the B&C and TDS is to find the exact distance in inches between stadias at a couple powers. You can call the company and they will give it to you. That way all you need is a ballistic program to run the numbers on MV (you will need that), altitude etc and a small 3x5 card will put you on. I have numbers for my 3-9 at 6x and 9x. That way you are not limited to one power as mentioned. Just have to be smarter than the simple instructions.
No they are not suited more much over 600 normally but they are relatively inexpensive (the Kahles 3-9 was $450 used and the Swarovski 6-18 was $800 used.) Their glass is second to none. A PDA will sell for under $100, a chrono for under $200 and exbal is under $50. Not much else is needed for their practical distances.
clicking is nice and essential IF it is long range and you have the time to look at the multiple drop charts, input data after multiple readings etc. I know I do that also. However, more shots are presented real world at 600 and under normally than over. The TDS is fast and reliable in that scenario.
Do not discount them because you do not have a $1000 scope and $2000 worth of computers and wind meters, etc.
Will give you a little hint, same system I mentioned above will work with the Burris B-Plex and the new Nikon Omegas and BDS reticles. All you need is the inches at a couple powers and a PDA.
BH
bailey1474
<strong>SPONSOR</strong>
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Goodgrouper, do you have a sylabus, books, materials, lists, etc. that I could purchase from you so that I can figure out what I'm doing. What is the deal about your seminars also. Could you send me some info? I'm eager to learn. Thanks.
Paul
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Hope I'm not stepping on GG toes but you don't need to buy a bunch of literature to do this. Just hang around here and learn to use the "search" function and you'll find the answers to most of your questions.
The seminar would be good though. Nothing like a little trigger time w/an accomplished LR shooter coaching you along.
Goodgrouper, do you have a sylabus, books, materials, lists, etc. that I could purchase from you so that I can figure out what I'm doing. What is the deal about your seminars also. Could you send me some info? I'm eager to learn. Thanks.
Paul
[/ QUOTE ]
Hope I'm not stepping on GG toes but you don't need to buy a bunch of literature to do this. Just hang around here and learn to use the "search" function and you'll find the answers to most of your questions.
The seminar would be good though. Nothing like a little trigger time w/an accomplished LR shooter coaching you along.
goodgrouper
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Goodgrouper was referring to people encountering problems when, being used to use the reticle for holdover at a certain magnification ( as is necessary in second plane reticles, whose size does not change), they could not use the magnification needed for the reticle.
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You are correct. That is a problem for most scopes.
Goodgrouper was referring to people encountering problems when, being used to use the reticle for holdover at a certain magnification ( as is necessary in second plane reticles, whose size does not change), they could not use the magnification needed for the reticle.
[/ QUOTE ]
You are correct. That is a problem for most scopes.
goodgrouper
Well-Known Member
BH,
I agree with you. However, you mentioned this:
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All you need is the inches at a couple powers and a PDA.
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If you have to worry about those powers and inch charts and are going to be carrying a PDA also, why not just throw out the first two things, use the PDA and have it tell you your MOA correction and be done with it?
I agree with you. However, you mentioned this:
[ QUOTE ]
All you need is the inches at a couple powers and a PDA.
[/ QUOTE ]
If you have to worry about those powers and inch charts and are going to be carrying a PDA also, why not just throw out the first two things, use the PDA and have it tell you your MOA correction and be done with it?
goodgrouper
Well-Known Member
No, you're not stepping on anyone's toes. I think you gave great advice. LRH can definetly cut down the learing curve.
Huntingshotgunhunter,
If you want to learn more about our services, shoot me an email. My addy is in my profile. Just click on my name.
Huntingshotgunhunter,
If you want to learn more about our services, shoot me an email. My addy is in my profile. Just click on my name.
sscoyote
Well-Known Member
All the companies that produce these generic type ballistic reticles provide basic systems for zeroing these reticles for intermediate range shooting that is simple to understand since 99% of shooters don't want to put the time and effort into studying more precise systems for applying them (windage for example). But there are more thorough and accurate systems. There are a couple references to study if u want. Here are 2 sources that i know of-- www.burrisoptics.com (Tech. Notes section), and this 1 may help also-- www.ottllc.com/specialtypistols/sp20.pdf
GP
I carry one laminated credit card sized card that has the reticle drawn with stadia lines and one side 6x and other 9x. Under each I simply write in the distances in yards for each stadia at the side. You can make them up for any known elevations and temps.
Using the TDS, with 300 WSM, I have exact zeros from 200 to about 700 on the stadia lines at 100 yd increments normally by switching power from 6-9x and 10mph winds with zero clicks. Range, put the stadia on target, and pull the trigger. Does not get any simpler than that.
Yep I am pretty much limited to 600-700 and 10 mph winds for exact knowns, but for a 9 lb carry rifle works extremely well. the 300 Hart with a 180 at 3200 fps can go to about 900 the same way using the 6-18x and two powers (12 and 18X). If I wanted to drop to 6x, it would go over 1000 but that is pushing the 6x capability for my taste.
Now if I am serious LR hunting from fixed position, then agree out comes the binder of pre-printed charts, windmeter, PDA etc and clicking is the way.
However, many here really do not have the guns, scopes, tools or equip or skill yet to go that far but they are wanting to get a clean and accurate kill at 400-600 really. The TDS is premier in simplicity for that with any relatively flat cartridge.
Darrel Holland is converting Leupolds to his Advanced Reticle that has dots at 2 or 3 MOA intervals with hash marks in between out to 24 MOA, Mils on top and sides for ranging. Cost is $375 on your scope. That is a super clean and fast system that takes a 300 Rum from 0-1000 with no clicks in zero wind. Any wind hold off on the mil marks or dial it in.
BH
I carry one laminated credit card sized card that has the reticle drawn with stadia lines and one side 6x and other 9x. Under each I simply write in the distances in yards for each stadia at the side. You can make them up for any known elevations and temps.
Using the TDS, with 300 WSM, I have exact zeros from 200 to about 700 on the stadia lines at 100 yd increments normally by switching power from 6-9x and 10mph winds with zero clicks. Range, put the stadia on target, and pull the trigger. Does not get any simpler than that.
Yep I am pretty much limited to 600-700 and 10 mph winds for exact knowns, but for a 9 lb carry rifle works extremely well. the 300 Hart with a 180 at 3200 fps can go to about 900 the same way using the 6-18x and two powers (12 and 18X). If I wanted to drop to 6x, it would go over 1000 but that is pushing the 6x capability for my taste.
Now if I am serious LR hunting from fixed position, then agree out comes the binder of pre-printed charts, windmeter, PDA etc and clicking is the way.
However, many here really do not have the guns, scopes, tools or equip or skill yet to go that far but they are wanting to get a clean and accurate kill at 400-600 really. The TDS is premier in simplicity for that with any relatively flat cartridge.
Darrel Holland is converting Leupolds to his Advanced Reticle that has dots at 2 or 3 MOA intervals with hash marks in between out to 24 MOA, Mils on top and sides for ranging. Cost is $375 on your scope. That is a super clean and fast system that takes a 300 Rum from 0-1000 with no clicks in zero wind. Any wind hold off on the mil marks or dial it in.
BH
sscoyote
Well-Known Member
It's available in some Leupolds. I used it this year on a friend's 7 Dakota XP-100 to shoot an antlerless deer @ 597 after dope was given for that range/conditions. Worked just fine. Love the windage stadia along the vertical axis. Nice reticle. I think it's right here-- www.hollandguns.com
