Scope bases (weld them)

Discussion in 'Long Range Scopes and Other Optics' started by ICANHITHIMMAN, Jul 20, 2008.

  1. ICANHITHIMMAN

    ICANHITHIMMAN Well-Known Member

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    Why dont we weld the scope bases to the receiver's? What could it hurt seams stronger than screws alone? Can it be done? Is it smart?
     
  2. adam

    adam Well-Known Member

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    Not needed; at best extremely difficult to do correctly, and at worst extremely dangerous.
     

  3. jwp475

    jwp475 Well-Known Member

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    Sure it could be done with a quality steel base. If I wanted them attached permanently then I would silver soldier them instead of welding, but don't so I use screws.
     
  4. ScottBerish

    ScottBerish Well-Known Member

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    Another method you might consider is epoxy (JB Weld) the base to receiver. This serves a dual purpose of bedding the base and securing it. Making sure the base is level is critical, of course, before curing. I know some Eurpoean snipers do this for Picatinny rails on the German G3 action.

    Scott
     
  5. ICANHITHIMMAN

    ICANHITHIMMAN Well-Known Member

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    I see

    I looked at a pic of an M40A1 on snipers hide and his bases were welded on. Thats why I was wondering why people dont do it.
     
  6. James Jones

    James Jones Well-Known Member

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    That was a crappy job , I'd be suspect of how hot he got the reciever or how cold he made those welds.

    The only real benifit would be a one piece base as it may stiffen the action , if TIG welded properly you can do it safely , not anymore dangerous than weldingthe lug to the bottom of and Encore barrel and I've done a couple of those.

    Good aluminum bases with good steel screws is as strong as you need , you break that off and your scope is gonna need a bit more than alittle buff to make it right.
     
  7. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    I would not recomend welding on any action!!!!

    Some of the reasons are,The heat generated could change the heattreat
    of the action,Welding stresses could warp/distort the action,Matching the
    steels and the welding rods/wire would be difficult if not impossible.

    It would be best to just buy an action with the scope base that is part of
    the action and alligned with the bolt center line.

    Stiller,RPA,Surgeon and Stolle make a action with integral scope bases.

    Even though these are a little more expensive than a factory action
    they could end up cheeper after you ruined a factory action and had
    to buy another action.

    It would definitely be safer.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  8. jwp475

    jwp475 Well-Known Member

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    The welding procees will certainly distort the action to some degree and possiable damage the heat treating of the action, but chosing a proper filler metal is not that big a deal.
    I say this since I am a certified welder as well as Inspector and have a seep knowledge of steels and their weldability and compatability with various filler metals
     
  9. Boss Hoss

    Boss Hoss Well-Known Member

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    This is the way I do it and the way that it was done by Speedy at SG&Y as we have both found that lock tite fails way too often =

    First use steel 000 steel wool and acetone and rough the contact area of the receiver and then do the same to the contact area of the base.

    Use a cotton ball with acetone to clean any residual off of the receiver contact area and the base or bases. Set aside the base and be careful not to touch the clean areas. Use a little paste wax on the tip of a toothpick to apply into the threaded areas on the receiver. Apply a very thin layer to the screw threads and to the bottom half of the screw head. Set screws on a clean shop towel -- you get the idea.

    Now use JB Weld because it can be heated and removed easier should you want to remove this later on. Mix it and use just a little die if you have it to more closely match the color of the bases and receiver. After mixing on you little piece of cardboard or index card set aside for a few minutes.

    Get your propane torch and heat the contact area of the receiver and the contact area of the bases just enough to bring out any moisture that may be present on the surface. When the bases and receiver have cooled back to less than 100 degrees (this will not take long because you did not heat them up that much) using the toothpick that you used to mix the JB put a small amount on the receiver mating surface and on the base mating surface. Don't worry about it oozing now carefully place the bases lining up the screw holes as closely as possible and gingerly set the base on the receiver---immediately place the screws in the holes and get all of them started a few turns.

    Now that the screws are started give a turn to one and move to the next screw. Repeat process until they are all snug then tighten each one to its final tension. This is important-----DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN. We do not want all of the epoxy to be completely squeezed out.

    Now leave the rifle in the vise and let sit for 5 minutes or so (I use rubber inserts so that the barrel can be clamped in) and get your capful of WD 40, cotton balls and Q-tips. First use dry q tips to remove most of the excess then take a cotton ball and dip a small portion in the WD 40 and very gingerly wipe down the areas you just removed the excess JB. You will notice that it comes of very easy but make sure not to press to hard on the edges where the base and receiver meet we don’t want to disturb that line.

    Use the q tip or the tip of a toothpick with WD 40 on it to clean out any of the epoxy that migrated through the top of the screw holes an also into the openings of any of the screws.

    Now look at the underside of the bases where any excess JB could have migrated into the opening of the receiver or just on top of the receiver for example. Note where a one piece base is used it likes to hide underneath. For this area use the q tip with some WD 40 applied to remove.

    Now go off and have lunch about an hour and use the q tips soaked with WD 40 to smooth (gently) the lines where the base and receiver meet. If you have done everything correctly it should look like one piece of metal!!!

    In 24 hours or 6 using a light to position over the bases to heat them you are ready to mount your scope.


    A final note here make sure to pre fit everything because it will really suck if you find out a base screw is too long and the rifle will not operate!!!
     
  10. Buffalobob

    Buffalobob Writers Guild

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    Thanks Boss Hoss. I needed to know that just at this very moment. That was very informative and I am going to take your advice on how to do it.

    Also just so you know that I don't ever forget- I am still waiting on my picture of a dead pig that you promised me. Unless you can claim that the hurricane drowned all the pigs you need to get out there and kill one and post a picture.
     
  11. matt magness

    matt magness New Member

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    I'm a welder by trade and have been thing of using weld to make my base more stable.I have put a great deal of thought into it and have decided if I were use weld to attach the base I will us stainless steal bases and screws (so when welded it does not burn the blue off), then to eliminate heat distortion (DO NOT WELD THE BASE TO THE ACTION)The welding process must be Tig,and great care must be used for proper ground.If not properly grounded heat and arc marks could damage the gun.Finally tack lightly the very edge of a socket cap screw to the base 1 in the rear and 1 in the front this should only be done by the very best welders to prevent damage.If all of this done properly the tack can be ground off and the screws may be removed.I will also have compressed air and a air nozzle to aid in rapid cooling.
     
  12. ICANHITHIMMAN

    ICANHITHIMMAN Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to the fourm. I think this was my very first post from Iraq in 2008 on my 29th birthday. I am also a welder or I was.
     
  13. Auto-X Fil

    Auto-X Fil Active Member

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    I have used JB weld with success. I can't say I've ever had an issue with dry assembly, but the JB'd guns take tons of abuse with aplomb.
     
  14. matt magness

    matt magness New Member

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    I wont do any thing other than tack mine.I don't care to cut any slots or groves on my action.I just ordered a new mount by grand reaper on piece mount cant wait to try it out on my new 25-06 look out white tail here I come!