S&B variable scopes

Discussion in 'Long Range Scopes and Other Optics' started by pfranklin, Jan 14, 2006.

  1. pfranklin

    pfranklin New Member

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    Hello. I'm interested in learning your experiences and opinions about Schmidt scopes. Specifically, I am considering their 3-12x42 standard variable with a custom installed BDC. Want to put this scope on a 300 Dakota... will probbaly not shoot past 400, and only then when conditions don't exceed my limited talents.
    After scanning a year's worth of posts in the optics section of this forum, it seems there is some question about whether a S&B rig will hold up to larger recoil, and also whether it will present value in proportion to the price. Also, I am interested in finding whether the FFP design obscures game at distance in the field. It seems as though it won't, but I've only used SFP scopes, specifically the Kahles American line, Leupold Mk4, and Leupold LR VX3s in 4.5-14 and 6.5-20, so any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
     
  2. ds

    ds Well-Known Member

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    pete7mm,

    I only have experience with the S&B PMII scopes.
    mildot or P4 reticle subtension is cca 7.4mm at 100m. In practice - a aiming mark of 1/2 MOA is fine for me.

    No problems with a PMII with 6-7 years of use.

    David.
     

  3. Pete Lincoln

    Pete Lincoln Well-Known Member

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    Pete, the question about S&B standing up to recoil was raised by some idiot who was on here and other web sights trying to cause a bunch of trouble a few weeks back.
    Let me tell you straight.
    Schmidt & Bender scopes are the finest in the world and are the ONLY scopes i use these days, and are the only scopes i'db trust my life to without question.
    The 3-12x42 is an excellent scope, i would advise the magnum eye relief version.
    you will have about 500m worth of elevation capability with the old style PM turrets. if you need to have more than that, it is possible to have the BDC made without a stup giving you more than one revolution, and thus more elevation, but the flip side of the coin is that you have to keep your eye on exactly which revolution you are.
    I would suggest you also look at the PMII line of scopes, they are the worlds best.
    Pete Lincoln
     
  4. Pete Lincoln

    Pete Lincoln Well-Known Member

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    Further to the question of FFP reticles, the subtention of the reticle is the same in coverage of target no matter what magnification, yes the reticle appears to change in size, but in relation to the target it stays exactly the same. giving you the ability to range with it on any magnification setting.
    Depending on desired application of the scope, there are several reticle choices available..

    David. this is a direct quote from the S&B construction tech in an email i recieved earlier this week:
    "Pete, sorry for not answering earlier to the e-mail correspondence you forwarded to us. But the answer I have now was propably worth the delay:

    I kept bugging the decision making guys here and now we have a final decision: The fine P4 reticle will be put into realization! As it looks now you will be able to have a look at it at this year's IWA (I guess you will attend the show?). Do you think the crosshair coverage of the Klein Reticle would be okay?"

    /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
    the pressure and direct( and boy where they direct) emails i send to Mr Bender must have paid off
    I suggest we wait for your 2nd 5-25 with just that ret, ?
    my 4-16x42PMII will be in for a ret change to Thin ( Pete Lincoln) P4 just as soon as they tell me its on.
    Pete
     
  5. ds

    ds Well-Known Member

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    Hi Pete,

    Great news. Ok, lets wait of the thin P4 in the other scope. I know it will be worth it.....and thanks for making this happen.

    David
     
  6. ILIKA308

    ILIKA308 Active Member

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    YOU CAN USE A SCHMIDT SCOPE TO DRIVE NAILS WITH AND IT WON'T HURT IT, THEY ARE GOOD AS THEY COME
     
  7. green 788

    green 788 Well-Known Member

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  8. pfranklin

    pfranklin New Member

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    Thanks for the information. Pete Lincoln... is the S&B tactical scope better optically than a standard variable? How do these two compare to the Zenith? It seems that the package around the lenses is different in all three, but the core is the same. Can I get the tactical in a 42mm objective? And how are they compared to Swarovski?
     
  9. green 788

    green 788 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not Pete but I think the S&B will be the better choice over the Swarovski. The USMC recently gave S&B a contract for over a million dollars worth of scopes, this to replace the aging (and reportedly failing) Unertl scopes on their sniper rifles. (Not slamming Unertl, it's just that those scopes are 25 to 30 years old--and older).

    Premier Reticle has the contract to replace the S&B mildot reticle with their Gen II model.

    Since the Marine Corp chose the S&B, I would have to believe it's a helluva tough scope. Of course the Navy Seals chose the Nightforce NXS, which is another fine choice. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    With the S&B, from what I've read, the PMII's do not have much windage and elevation adjustment (which seems weird, given the size of the tubes)--so you would need an elevated scope base in order to be able to dial out to 1000 yards for most cartridges. I think the recommendation is for a 29 MOA base.


    Dan
     
  10. Pete Lincoln

    Pete Lincoln Well-Known Member

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    The zenith is replacing the classic line, its new shape, apparently better coatings'than the classic(but i cant tell the difference) I'd choose a S&B over a Swarovski or Zeiss any day. there is nothing wrong with the classic line, the zeniths (although looking like a french wine bottle) have the superb flash dot in much of the range. excellent for moving targets.
    The PMII's have 13mils or elevation in 1 turn, put that on a 20moa base and you have plenty of adjustment. get the double turn and you've even more( the varmint and ph scopes have limited elevation, your only good to 550 yards or so depending on caliber)
    I can whole heartedly recomend S&B scopes.
    The PMII tacticals are probably tougher, thicker tubes, mil spec etc, but that doesn't mean the hunting type scopes aren't tough, they are as tough or tougher than anything else out there.
    and yes, the PMII 4-16x is available in a 42mm Obj.
    regards Pete
     
  11. jb1000br

    jb1000br Well-Known Member

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    pete7mm...I'm selling one in the buy sell section on this site!

    3-12x42 like new!

    JB
     
  12. pfranklin

    pfranklin New Member

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    Thank you for the information, gentlemen.