Recoil

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by McDewbie, May 30, 2011.

  1. McDewbie

    McDewbie Active Member

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    I have looked about 20 pages in on this forum (basics starting out) and another one I cant remember and I can't find any info on recoil. I have found a basic table, Rifle Recoil Table and a calculator to find out roughly what your recoil is Recoil Calculator just remember that this calculator and table are the mathematically correct amounts and are NOT what you are feeling. With that said I am a novice, to say the least, of a LRH, so any info from people who aren't would be greatly appreciated (I'm sure someone is going to find this helpful besides just me). Also wondering if anyone has some ideas to up the weight of a gun, without destroying it structurally, so as to reduce mathematical recoil. I would like to forget about the effect recoil pads have as that is my "whoops my math was off" contingency. I so far have heard of drilling holes into the butt of the rifle and putting fishing weights into it, recoil reducers you put in the stock that spread out the total recoil time and make it more bearable, and wrapping the barrel of your rifle with lead solder and ten shrink wrapping it in place (although I have no idea what kind of effect this would have, arent barrels better if they arent touching anything?). Any info you can help will help me, and hopefully others.
    Thanks, Evan
     
  2. RDM416

    RDM416 Well-Known Member

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    McDewbie,

    There are various ways to deal with recoil. The various recoil tables will simply tell you "how much" recoil a given load/rifle combination will have. Useful information, but it only goes so far.

    First of all, it is important to manage recoil well in a LR hunting rig for a variety of reasons. If your rifle kicks the snot out of you, you will not shoot it much, you will develop a "flinch" and you simply will not shoot it well. Although not necessary, it is also good to be able to get back on the scope quickly enough to see your bullet impact.

    How to manage recoil? Weight. Muzzle brake. You have already mentioned adding weight to your rifle. This can be done in variety of ways. Drilling holes in the butt and filling with lead (use #8 or #9 shotgun pellets mixed with epoxy, no lose stuff in the stock). Some will also cut out underneath the barrel and glue in lead shot to keep the balance better if also adding to the butt. The mercury recoil recoil reducers work as well, be sure to follow the directions. Like the lead, those need to be installed tightly so there is no movement. Changing out to a heavier stock is another method of adding weight. DO NOT SOLDER OR ADD WEIGHT TO YOUR BARREL!!!!!

    A muzzle brake is the other commonly used method that can be added to any rifle. Brakes are very effective although some types are more effective than others. There is quite a lot of information on this site on brakes, so do a search and some reading. If you are going to be shooting a hard kicking caliber a brake is necessary in my opinion. Just remember the hearing protection!!!!!!

    Many shooters on this site use a combination of the two. A heavy rifle with a brake can tame down even the hardest kicking calibers. One of the rifles I hunt with a lot is a 338 Khan (338-378 wby wildcat) and is a real beast shooting 300 grain bullets at over 3000fps. It has a very efficient brake and weights in at 17 lbs. My Daughter was shooting this rifle when she was 10. I have had several kids from 10 to 13 years old kill deer with this rifle at ranges of 300 yards and more. Recoil is very mild, my 308 AR has more "felt" recoil.

    One other side advantage to adding weight is it will make the rifle more stable. Then you get into the discussion of "how heavy is too heavy?" That depends on everyones preference, what and where you will be hunting and just how much weight you are willing to pack. I commonly pack my 15 to 17 lb rifles elk hunting on foot in NM. I will gripe and complain about the weight until it is time to take a long shot then I am glad I have it, and after all, being able to make the shot is what it is all about!!
     

  3. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    i don't know how to calculate it. i know that with a vais muzzle brake that my 7mm mag kicks like a 243. my 6.5-284 with no brake is still comfortable is more than i like. get brake you will not have to calculate it. wear muffs and puffs at the range.
     
  4. ken snyder

    ken snyder Well-Known Member

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    Felt recoil is not the same as calculated recoil. The more mass ( YOU ) the rifle encounters the faster recoil energy disipates. A heavy shoulder doesnt move as easily as a light one. Larger Rifles also twist due to spinning the bullet, adding to the discomfort level. Slap, shove and twist are comparative terms each with a different remedy. An over looked remedy is too shoot the heaviest bullet your rifle will support. Remember in energy, velocities are squared while weight is multipied, this also applies to gunpowder charge weight as well. A slower bullet also spreads the felt recoil over a longer time, reducing slap and twist. This does not hold true with all cartridges, but if you crunch the math you can reduce the most annoying part of recoil, what ever it is for you. Also a stock that fits properly and designed for its intent, is priceless, and surpasses well beyond the remedy measures.
     
  5. 400bull

    400bull Well-Known Member

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    One of the best ways I have found to manage recoil can be done for pennies. HEARING PROTECTION!!!!! I swear that having hearing protection on while shooting reduces the felt recoil as much or more then my limbsaver recoil pad. I know it sounds silly, I have chalanged may people on it and everyone has said that their rifle kicks way less with hearing protection then with out.

    400bull
     
  6. rscott5028

    rscott5028 Well-Known Member

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    Great question. But... the math means almost nothing except as a relative comparison because every person is different. So, the exact calculation is moot because more velocity+energy vs lighter weight rifle/shooter == more felt recoil.

    The best thing to do is to shoot a lot of different rifles.

    There's no need to fear recoil. In fact, it's a good thing to practice without a brake every now and then to train yourself to follow through with each shot and not react to the recoil and/or the noise.

    A bipod or good front rest will promote good technique which is a whole other topic. Suffice it to say that if you hold the rifle correctly, you won't be injured from the recoil. So, it really is 99% mental.

    That said, an accurate magnum rifle with minimal felt recoil is a pleasure to shoot which results in more practice and better shooting.

    As stated by others, weight and brakes are very effective and I'm never ashamed to use one although you should be courteous and try not blasting adjacent shooters at the range.

    With or without a brake, you should always wear hearing protection.

    -- richard
     
  7. McDewbie

    McDewbie Active Member

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    at this point (I dont have my license and therefore not allowed to shoot) the only thing i have to go on is the math. I know it isnt what I'll feel but I can't shoot every gun to get a feel for them, so It's unfortunatly all I have to go on until mid august when my license will be here (as long as i pass the test). which sucks.
    Thanks, Evan
     
  8. rscott5028

    rscott5028 Well-Known Member

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    What country do you live in?

    My son is average size or below for his age. He's been shooting a Sendero 7mm Rem Mag since he was 14. He shot a box or so just fine when it was new. Then I added a brake and he really enjoys shooting it now. 60-100 shots in a day is no problem.

    If you stay with 7mm Rem Mag or below, about 3000 ft-lbs at the muzzle, you won't have any problems. ...especially if you get a brake.

    The Savage 111LRH has sufficient weight plus a brake already installed.

    Recoil is the least of your problems. Stay away from featherweight rifles and you'll be fine.

    You need to look for a cartridge that meets your ballistic requirements the rest will fall into place.

    You also need a shooting partner or somewhere to get lessons?

    -- richard
     
  9. McDewbie

    McDewbie Active Member

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    I've been shooting before, mainly smaller calibers, before and was easily able to shoot all day long, I am a decent shot and I know how to shoot fairly well (in my opinion) but now I am legally an adult I need my license to shoot, and with it I can have a gun in my house, no more shooting my grandpas gun. also I live in Canada, much stricter gun laws. I do plan on shooting alot before school starts in september, like a couple hundred rounds... and Rscott, thats the exact gun I plan on getting, in 300 winchester mag
    Thanks, Evan
     
  10. rscott5028

    rscott5028 Well-Known Member

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    That sounds great.

    Which gun? Rem or Sav?

    Either way, I'm sure you'll love it.

    -- Richard
     
  11. McDewbie

    McDewbie Active Member

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    sorry, was all caught up in the thought that you pulled out the one gun I am getting I forgot to specify which one, the savage 111 LRH in 300 Winchester Magnum, my grandpa swears by savage, and the 111 LRH looked like a to meet everything I am looking for.
    Thanks, Evan