rcbs gold metal seater die vrs redding ?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by grizzlydueck, Jun 21, 2012.

  1. grizzlydueck

    grizzlydueck Member

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    I want to upgrade my performance out of my winchester 7wsm brass for example correct the run out -the rcbs comp dies are different from the gold metal but does anybody have any experience with the gold metal seater die and does it match the performance of the redding or other top comp dies ?
    thanks so much for any info
     
  2. boomtube

    boomtube Well-Known Member

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    "...does it match the performance of the redding or other top comp dies ?"

    No. In fact ONLY Redding/Forster seaters with full length sleeves that align both the bullets and cases before seating starts offer an accuracy advantage over more conventional seaters and are worth the extra cost.

    It's worth mentioning that no seater can make straight ammo in cases with out of line necks.
     

  3. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    I agree with boomtube on this. He is spot on.

    Jeff
     
  4. rscott5028

    rscott5028 Well-Known Member

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    Pay particular attention to that last statement...

    I would add that I've had pretty good success with Wilson hand dies and an arbor press. ...not sure how the other guys feel. But, I think they have a huge advantage in that you can easily tweak seating depth at the range.

    -- richard
     
  5. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    I pretty much go the same route that you do. I'm also kinda odd in that I prefer the old style seater die to the new ones with micrometer on the Wilsons. I just use a metal shim under the head.

    Now I'm a "garbage in-garbage out" kinda guy. I believe that if you start with good strait cases; the rest will fall in place. I use almost nothing but Forster seaters (threaded), but with three or four exceptions. Plus it's a given that no seater can straiten up a bad case! Most guys will inspect a case after resizing, and that's OK. But you really want to check it before resizing as well. Look for a bump or a hicky made by the extractor (rather common). I keep a small India Stone just to remove those bumps. A thousandth there really trigs out to some substantial numbers in a 3" long case.

    One thing about the Forster seaters that alot of folks ignore is that they can order in a smaller caliber, and ream it out with their chamber reamer. An example would be a 6mmx45mm round. You can start with a .222 and literally make the seater fit your chamber. Sinclair used to sell all the spare parts for Forster dies (guess they still do?)
    gary
     
  6. woods

    woods Well-Known Member

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    I have the RCBS Gold Medal and the RCBS Comp Seater

    [​IMG]

    Both let you insert the bullet in the side into an opening and it falls down in it's collet which holds it in line with the neck of the case (WARNING: very addictive, once you get used to it you will hate using the others). The bullet starts straight and is easier to seat, less stress on the neck brass. I also have some Redding Competition Seaters which I get when I can't find one of the RCBS Comp Seaters and it takes more force to start the bullet seating than with the RCBS.

    The Gold Medal RCBS differs in 3 ways from the RCBS Comp seater

    1. The bullet collet covers the neck, bears on the shoulder and comes down 1/4" down the case body (the Comp seater only covers the neck and shoulder)
    2. The seating stem is stainless and floats up and down unlike the Comp seater which has a fixed black seating stem
    3. The Gold Medal somehow will hold the bullet and not let it fall through. IOW if you drop a bullet in the side window of the Comp seater it will fall through unless you have raised the ram high enough to hold it in place (convenient but not necessarily necessary)

    Personally I have chased concentricity extensively and I can tell no difference in the final product between the Redding Competition Seater and the RCBS Competition Seater and I love the side window.

    YMMV
     
  7. ppoole

    ppoole Member

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    I have two redding competition sets and two rcbs completion seating dies.

    The rcbs is easy to use dropping the bullet into the window and does a good job. My redding seater does much better with runout due to the case being supported during the process. What I found that eliminates the most runout is the bushing style neck sizers because they provide even tension around the entire case neck. I inspect my brass before and after sizing either discarding or using as a fouling shot.

    I do prefer the redding dies much more. I use lapua brass if I can get it in that caliber because I discard fewer pieces of brass. I use nosler for my 300 rum with great results. I get more runout when I use Remington brass.

    I get .001-.002 runout commonly with the redding always correct down to .001 or smaller. I get .003-.005 with the the rcbs, but still get a good many in the .001-.002 range. I measure contrencity using both Sinclair and hornady but I correct using the hornady (I do get some small differences in measurement between the two). If I can ever get a redding competition seater for my 45-110 sharps I would be in reloading heaven.

    Saying all that I am happy with results of both but prefer redding. I got the rcbs on sale and at the time needed to pinch some pennies.
     
  8. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    I fool around with a lot of different bullets and bullet powder combos when I'm searching out a new load. I found the Redding die sets to have way more backlash built into their micrometer heads than the Forster. Have only seen one or two RCBS Competetion die sets in my life time, so won't say much good or bad about them.

    As for a 45-110 seater: piece of cake if you got a reamer. You can use either a 45-70 die from Redding or Forster (you can buy the sleeve from Forster or Sinclair. Not sure about getting spare parts from Redding as I've never tried it. Redding copied Forster's design, so the rest is easy. As for the micrometer heads, I think all Forsters are interchangable. I've seen one other micrometer headed die set in either 45-110 or 45-120, but it was pretty much custom built from the start. I'm assuming your filling these cases with black powder, and love the idea. I shoot two 38-55's, and have had the want for a 40-65 for eons (in a Hi-Wall of course!)
    gary
     
  9. ppoole

    ppoole Member

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    Yeah I will have to look into that with the 45-110. I use kik 1f for them now, we tried a lot of powders but that was the one the gun loved and br2. The pickiest gun ever. I have one coming from Shiloh with a 7 degree lead so I can only load lead and black. I will look into the sleeve. Grease grooves beat paper patch time wise thank you.

    I only have the rcbs seater though, but redding has given me great results
     
  10. RTK

    RTK Well-Known Member

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    I have an RCBS comp seater die which I have used for a year or so and have found the TIR to be very good, usually .001 sometimes better sometimes worse, seems to depend on the worthiness of the case going in.
    Years ago I had to send a Redding neck sizing die back because of run out, they were great and sent me a new die back no quesitons asked and in record time.
     
  11. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    Keep this in mind with the Forster seater All of them are pretty much the samething quality, but some have the micrometer head while others don't. You can always add the micrometer head later if so desired. I'd be looking for a Forster 45-70 seater die on Ebay if I had the reamer. Also Forster will cut you a custom die fairly reasonable (they need three once fired cases)

    I'm kinda entertaining the idea of building two BP metalic cartridge rifles for long range shooting (750yd.-1000yd). I seem to keep going back to the .400-.405 bullets diameters. Love Hi-Walls, and most of the better falling blocks.
    gary
     
  12. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    Redding acting like that is a rare animal! Usually they want to argue with you till you give up.
    gary
     
  13. ppoole

    ppoole Member

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    The custom sounds like the easiest thank you.

    I spent a lot of time with a guy that shot professionally and he shot 45-70 in competition especially 750-1000 yard. He liked 40-65 for silhouette, and his wife won a national championship with it. He hates the idea of me getting a 45-110 but I love it
     
  14. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    honestly, I never heard of it till around 2002! I worked with Russ Combs (a well known BP shooter), and he put me onto it. Think at the time he had two rifles in that chambering, and was building another. This advice comming from him got my attention real quick. Here's a guy that hit's the gong at 1000 yards so often that it boring
    gary