Question for John Burns????

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by lerch, May 3, 2005.

  1. lerch

    lerch <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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    Hi, my name is Steve from Oklahoma and I just wanted to say me and several other hunters around here love your show and I think you are doing a lot of good for this sport. My question is about the video equipment you use. I have noticed on several shots on your video and show that you can see the "bullet trace" or whatever you call it. I have noticed this myself several times target shooting or thumping long range prairie dogs. I am wondering how I could capture this on film. I am planning on using a 40 or 60 power spotting scope with a attachment to connect my sony mini-dv camcorder to it. I am wondering if this combo would be enough to capture this unique effect when shooting. I have video us shooting before and I have notice that when shooting a 300 rum with a 125 ballistic tip at 3450 fps I can film 2 or 3 frames of video between the muzzle blast and the bullet impact a 100yds. I don't know if this camera would be high speed enough to do some real good long range videoing. I am just wondering what ideas you or anyone else might have. THanks again and I can't wait to see next weeks show. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
     
  2. ricka0

    ricka0 Well-Known Member

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    Lou Boyd is a EE who builds astronomical telescopes for a university in Ar is an expert on this topic. I would post the question at Xtreme Accuracy with at subject <font color="purple"> How do I video "bullet trace"? Lou? </font>
     

  3. Dave King

    Dave King Well-Known Member

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    I have recorded "trace" using both of my standard video cameras. One's an old Sony and the other a newer model digital Sony. I don't think there's any magic to capture trace.
     
  4. ricka0

    ricka0 Well-Known Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I have recorded "trace" using both of my standard video cameras. One's an old Sony and the other a newer model digital Sony. I don't think there's any magic to capture trace.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    Magic - No - science and Engineering, unquestionably. If your only goal is to get an identifiable trace, not that difficult.
    [​IMG]]
    If you want to capture a bullet cutting the deck as in the image above, it takes a bit more.
     
  5. goodgrouper

    goodgrouper Well-Known Member

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    I too have recorded many vapor trails in hours and hours of chuck hunt video over the years. I have just been using a standard 8mm Samsung with no special gadgetry. I have footage of vapor trails of everything from 17 hmr's to .338's and even a fifty! The vapor trails vary from condition to condition, but the 300 grain MK still produces the biggest trail as it "shovels" air out of the way en route to the target!
     
  6. Dave King

    Dave King Well-Known Member

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    BB

    I believe the original quest was about capturing trace on video as viewed from behind, the projectile along the line of flight. I don't think we're after a picture of a bullet in flight as viewed from the side in your strobe photo example.

    I believe even if we were to try to capture "trace" from a 90 degrees to line of flight position we'd need a shadowgraph type photo and it'd represent little other than a neat looking photo. The 'trace' is of little value if it can't be used to observe the majority of the flight path and call impact.
     
  7. ricka0

    ricka0 Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, but my point was the quality of the trace. Also you can take nice traces from 90 degree view with very high end equipment.
    Lou can advise on how to capture video in a range of prices. He advised me on how to connect video to a microscope so I could video a frozen spider come back to life. Far more horrifying than any horror movie I've seen.
     
  8. lerch

    lerch <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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    Thanks for all the info so far. I guess what I am wondering about really is about the attaching mini dv camcorder to a spotting scope. I asked this question to john burns because I have seen the other hunting host on his show using a camera attached to a spotting scope. I have found universal attachment for this from nikon but I don't know if it will only fit nikon spotting scopes, I also don't know where they rank in quality. I know I can't afford a swaro but I would like to get something that will work good for long range videoing. I am open to suggestions.

    Thanks
     
  9. mad4hunting

    mad4hunting New Member

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    John, I watch your program all the time, "The Best of The West" and woulld like to know what specific rifle scopes you use on your rifles and what range finders you use I have never seen any of these range finders. Thanks
     
  10. rost495

    rost495 Well-Known Member

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    Big Bore

    Wondering if you or anyone has luck in simply recording mirage? I've never tried and always wanted a mirage reading tape while I was in the middle of the pack shooting position long range. No one ever offered it, just how to read mirage. But nothing like see this is X mph and fire a round. Then see it building, thats another 2mph and the shot will land "right there" and fire another.

    Of course since then I"ve learned how easy it is to clean the 600 yard target but it would still be nice to have some instructional tape like that.

    Jeff
     
  11. John Burns

    John Burns Well-Known Member

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    Lerch,

    It is difficult to use a spotter to film thru due to the extreme magnification.

    Example: a spotter set at 20x and the camera set at 20x gives 400x.

    This works OK on an animal at 1500 yds but it gives such a small field of view it is difficult to view trace at normal long range shooting distances(400-700 yds or so).

    We simply use our standard camera lenses that have 16-20x optical zooms. In a static situation I have a 2x doubler that works well but it prevents the use of the lower end of the zoom and does not give the viewer a good feel for the distance to the target.

    All video camera shooting normal video capture 60 frames per second so if you have a decent lens and the right conditions I think you will have better luck using just the camera.

    The correct term for the phenomena you sometimes see on our show is “Trace”. This is the air in front of the bullet being compressed and the light refracting thru the different densities of compressed and non compressed air.

    This creates the tube of mirage visible in a spotter or with a camera.

    Another phenomenon is much rarer and is the formation of a vapor trail or contrail such as is seen behind a jet aircraft. It requires some fairly rare atmospheric conditions and I have only seen it with small bores shooting close to the ground.

    To use your video camera thru the spotter set the spotter to its lowest magnification and the camera to the highest optical zoom and line up as best you can. Some brackets can be fabricated or the two tripod method or a good camera man can get decent results handholding the camera.

    Thanks for the comments about the show and sorry it takes me so long to respond but things are pretty busy.
     
  12. Bud Meadows

    Bud Meadows Well-Known Member

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    John Burns: I'd love to hear your reply to Mad4hunting regarding the type of scope you use on your show. I'd love to get one myself.