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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics
Preping to Play with 300gr Berger Hybrids
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<blockquote data-quote="royinidaho" data-source="post: 396908" data-attributes="member: 2011"><p>Preliminary results of the test. Interesting comparison but much too early to make a statement one way or another.</p><p></p><p>Loaded 3 shots w/US-839, 101 gr and SMKs as the check load. This is my goto load. Velocity average was 2337 with an ES of +/- 1 for 3 - 3 shot groups last year.</p><p></p><p>I was expecting 2735 fps w/ES of 1 and 0.6 to 0.5 MOA. Average velocity was 2773 and 0.75 MOA @ 200 yds and an ES of 26. Must have been different daylight conditions that accounted for the increased 40 FPS. No understood reason for the increased ES.</p><p></p><p>Loaded 3 with the same 101 grain US-869 with the ogive "almost" touching the rifling. Average velocity was 2716. ES = 18 and a group size of 2.65 MOA. Shot a real nice but large triangle.</p><p></p><p>Loaded 3 more with 101 gr US-869 and jumped them 0.040" more that the first three. Average velocity was 2735. ES = 47. Group size = 2.23 MOA. Again a nice large triangle centered about 1/2 MOA to the right.</p><p></p><p>The center of each group was about 1.5 MOA high. About correct @ 200 for a 300 yd zero.</p><p></p><p></p><p>The extra 0.040' jump made very little difference except for shifting the POI to the right.</p><p></p><p>I did some pondering and figured that 2 things could be incorrect.</p><p></p><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">The bullet may not like US-869 and,</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">The Hybrid may not act like the typical Berger bullet design.</li> </ol><p>So, as is typical for me, I changed two variables instead of one for the next three shots.</p><p></p><p></p><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Switched to 90.5 gr of Retumbo and</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Seated the Hybrids 0.003" longer than those just touching the rifling. Just touching means no marks are shown on the bullet when the live round is extracted.</li> </ol><p>Very slight, though noticeable if attention is paid, bolt close resistance could be felt and a very small mark existed when the 0.003" longer loads were chambered and extracted.</p><p></p><p>The shots with 90.5 of Retumbo averaged 2772 (1 FPS less than the SMK US-869 load) ES = 66 (not so good) Group was spot on windage wise, 1.5 MOA high as were the other Hybrid groups with a size of 0.875 MOA.</p><p></p><p>Here's what will happen Monday if it isn't raining.</p><p></p><p></p><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Load the Hybrids 0.003' more for a total of 0.006" increase over the "just touching" loads with 90.5 of Retumbo. (To see if the group shrinks or enlarges)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">If the group shrinks, load 101 gr US-869 to see if the bullet has a thing against the powder</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">If the group gets bigger then drop back to the 0.003" longer than the "just touching" loads to validate today's results.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">If today's results are not matched with the above tests then, tweek with powder charge weights a bit. (I'm plenty below 'my' max but not much.)</li> </ol><p>There should be a definite indication of where things are by then.</p><p></p><p>B1-3: Hybrids seated "just touching" w/101gr US-869</p><p>B4-6: Hybrids seated 0.040 back w/101gr US-869</p><p>B7-9: Hybrids seated 0.003" longer than B1-3, w/90.5gr Retumbo.</p><p></p><div style="text-align: center">All shots 200 yds</div> <div style="text-align: center">Prone/bipod/rear bags</div> <div style="text-align: center">The target is so blotchy due to hanging in the rain for a day<img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite11" alt=":rolleyes:" title="Roll Eyes :rolleyes:" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":rolleyes:" /></div> <div style="text-align: center"></div><p><img src="http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a243/royinidaho/Hybrid1stGroups.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="royinidaho, post: 396908, member: 2011"] Preliminary results of the test. Interesting comparison but much too early to make a statement one way or another. Loaded 3 shots w/US-839, 101 gr and SMKs as the check load. This is my goto load. Velocity average was 2337 with an ES of +/- 1 for 3 - 3 shot groups last year. I was expecting 2735 fps w/ES of 1 and 0.6 to 0.5 MOA. Average velocity was 2773 and 0.75 MOA @ 200 yds and an ES of 26. Must have been different daylight conditions that accounted for the increased 40 FPS. No understood reason for the increased ES. Loaded 3 with the same 101 grain US-869 with the ogive "almost" touching the rifling. Average velocity was 2716. ES = 18 and a group size of 2.65 MOA. Shot a real nice but large triangle. Loaded 3 more with 101 gr US-869 and jumped them 0.040" more that the first three. Average velocity was 2735. ES = 47. Group size = 2.23 MOA. Again a nice large triangle centered about 1/2 MOA to the right. The center of each group was about 1.5 MOA high. About correct @ 200 for a 300 yd zero. The extra 0.040' jump made very little difference except for shifting the POI to the right. I did some pondering and figured that 2 things could be incorrect. [LIST=1] [*]The bullet may not like US-869 and, [*]The Hybrid may not act like the typical Berger bullet design. [/LIST] So, as is typical for me, I changed two variables instead of one for the next three shots. [LIST=1] [*]Switched to 90.5 gr of Retumbo and [*]Seated the Hybrids 0.003" longer than those just touching the rifling. Just touching means no marks are shown on the bullet when the live round is extracted. [/LIST] Very slight, though noticeable if attention is paid, bolt close resistance could be felt and a very small mark existed when the 0.003" longer loads were chambered and extracted. The shots with 90.5 of Retumbo averaged 2772 (1 FPS less than the SMK US-869 load) ES = 66 (not so good) Group was spot on windage wise, 1.5 MOA high as were the other Hybrid groups with a size of 0.875 MOA. Here's what will happen Monday if it isn't raining. [LIST=1] [*]Load the Hybrids 0.003' more for a total of 0.006" increase over the "just touching" loads with 90.5 of Retumbo. (To see if the group shrinks or enlarges) [*]If the group shrinks, load 101 gr US-869 to see if the bullet has a thing against the powder [*]If the group gets bigger then drop back to the 0.003" longer than the "just touching" loads to validate today's results. [*]If today's results are not matched with the above tests then, tweek with powder charge weights a bit. (I'm plenty below 'my' max but not much.) [/LIST] There should be a definite indication of where things are by then. B1-3: Hybrids seated "just touching" w/101gr US-869 B4-6: Hybrids seated 0.040 back w/101gr US-869 B7-9: Hybrids seated 0.003" longer than B1-3, w/90.5gr Retumbo. [CENTER]All shots 200 yds Prone/bipod/rear bags The target is so blotchy due to hanging in the rain for a day:rolleyes: [/CENTER] [IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a243/royinidaho/Hybrid1stGroups.jpg[/IMG] [/QUOTE]
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