Powder around neck?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by Rem700addict, Jan 27, 2013.

  1. Rem700addict

    Rem700addict Well-Known Member

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    I've been reloading my .300wm and I've noticed that my cases have been getting a lot of powder residue around the outside of the case neck. Is this normal, or signs of high pressure, bad seating depth? My 180 loads are Hornady interlock btsp with 77.5grns of H1000, and I loaded up some Sierra 165grn btsp with 79grns of H1000. These loads by the book are well under max and I've been seating them .030 thousandths off the lands. I don't tumble my cases and they are on their 3rd reloading. Any info would be great, thanks.
     
  2. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    Probably need to anneal the case necks. They are getting hard and not sealing up to the chamber. I am going to guess since you have only 3 firings you are using a die that over sizes and then drags a expander ball back through?

    Jeff
     

  3. Rem700addict

    Rem700addict Well-Known Member

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    Yeah Jeff, i'm using the Lee die set that downsizes the neck and drags the decapping rod with enlarger through it. Also the gun is a Rem 700 SPS 26" Barrel. Can you point me in the right direction as to how to anneal the brass, I don't have much equipment yet, or should I discard this brass. I hate to discard it as I haven't got that many reloads out of it yet.
     
  4. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    The reason you need to anneal already is the type of dies you have undersize the brass down then open them back up. This process overworks the necks and makes them harden from the working. This is why I choose a bushing die with no expander ball and only size it down to what is needed.

    There are many ways to anneal. I would use the search box in the upper right corner and search some of the threads and methods. They range from simple home made jigs to hold them in a torch to the new machines. I use a "Bench Source" annealing machine and love it for it's speed and case to case consistency.

    Jeff
     
  5. Snowman

    Snowman Member

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    Rem 700 Annealing case necks can be done with very little equipment. All you need is a metal cake pan with sides approx 1 1/2 inches high, a small propane torch and an old screwdriver. Fill your pan with approx 1 inch of water. Stand your cases on their heads in neat rows. In a slightly darkened room direct the flame of your propane torch at the neck of the case. Do NOT heat the neck until it is cherry red. Heat it until you just see the neck starting to turn red ,remove the flame and tip the case into the water. Your case is now annealed. Dry your cases ,lube and resize as you normally would. Make sure the inside of the cases and primer pockets are dry before priming. There will be some discolouration on the neck area so you may want to run your cases through your polisher. If you heat the necks too hot they will be too soft to properly hold the bullets firmly. Simply load these cases and fire them single shot at targets. After you fire them and resize them again they will start to work harden and will be fine again. Hope that helps.
     
  6. Reloader222

    Reloader222 Well-Known Member

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    Also use the pan method long ago and later switched to the rotating holder in a drill. I think Hornady also makes this kind of kit. Not too expensive. You can make it yourself by taking a socket with a bolt through. You can also use Tempil to show you the right temperature. Do not apply it to all cases since you struggle afterwards to remove it. Just use one as an indicator and count it down. Then use it as a benchmark for the rest of the cases.

    Also read later on reloading forums that one should not anneal too much since the case would loose too much springback on the neck area. The recommendation is that you should hold the case in your hand while holding the neck at the propane torch. The momemt it starts to burn your fingers drop it in the bucket. I found this method to be a torture. Best way is to count it down until with the first one and thereafter use the counts as the benchmark for the rest.

    Lastly if the carbon buildup is only on the neck area it is fine, but the moment it spread to the shoulders there is usually not sufficient pressure or the shoulders was sized back too far during sizing.
     
  7. Rem700addict

    Rem700addict Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info guys, I might. Try this on a few cases or just get more brass. Does that blowback account for any accuracy loss? I'm sure it would if I continued using it ASIs which I don't plan on doing. Thanks again.
     
  8. savagelover

    savagelover Well-Known Member

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    I have never annealed a case in my life.And I get like 8 to 10 loading out of my 308 win brass.I use Lee dies and push the shoulder back .002 is all...I would try a little faster burn powder and see if it still does it..Sometime powder will case a blow back..why...no idea,,,good luck:rolleyes:
     
  9. ntg

    ntg Well-Known Member

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    I'm just starting to play with a 7-08 and using some used brass a friend gave to me. The cases belong to his father that rarely shot them, only when hunting. He did shoot a lot in the BR matches. My first reloads with these used brass are getting powder back onto the shoulders. I'm also suspect that most of these are not very hot loads as I didn't load them for getting "the one", just mostly for breaking in, and possibily seeing if some of the combos would give me a hit to where my accuracy load will be found.

    Anyway my question for now is are the Lee collet dies better at not over working the neck? I've had pretty good experience with them in other reloads.
     
  10. Catfur

    Catfur Well-Known Member

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    My 300 RUM does the same (carbon on neck). With everything from factory rounds to minimum loads, to max loads. And my hand loads are with freshly annealed brass.
     
  11. ntg

    ntg Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I'd think I'm ok, but not sure. As long as accuracy is there, am I o.k.?

    These used cases fit my chamber, before working them at all, so all I did was size the neck with the Lee collet die. I'm going to shoot them more and see if it has more to do with the slight differences in chamber "fit".
     
  12. 7stw

    7stw Well-Known Member

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    I have always thought that chamber dimensions are part of that " issue". Most of the factory chambers seem to be very liberal, especially with the magnum, and super mag chambers. It seems that my rifles that were chambered to minimum specs, do not soot the necks, and resizing is effortless. On the rifles that I do have, that soot the necks, no matter what, resizing is more of an effort. Maybe there's something to that, maybe not, just a thought! :)
     
  13. Tikkamike

    Tikkamike Well-Known Member

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    i can't swear that I'm right but I tend to disagree with the annealing theirs... were talking 55,000 +psi....even the hardest neck will still expand under that pressure. I think there is a good chance the chamber needs a good cleaning. That's my guess
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2013
  14. ntg

    ntg Well-Known Member

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    FWIW, mine happened with a factory new, and cleaned chamber. I don't own a belted mag, but have seen more sooting on them in general. I always assumed it was becuase they headspace on the belt and so manufactures didn't care as much if the specs were a little sloppy around the neck and shoulder.

    I'm going to neck size these cases of mine and see if the fire forming that should have happened made a difference. May load some a little hotter too, to see if that does anything.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2013