new barrel

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by marketello, Nov 10, 2004.

  1. marketello

    marketello Well-Known Member

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    I I have a rifle built, are there barrels that are a compromise, for the hunter and the benchrest.

    If you built a 30-06 and wanted to get more accuracy out of it (besides range practice), would you put a 26" barrel on it?

    Do they make a barrel that is heavier, but not as heavy as a varmit barrel?

    When I finally come down from this overload of info I am getting here, I would like to buy and modify, or build a longrange rifle that would still be suited for a long walk.

    Would love to hear suggestions starting with a REM 700 action.
     
  2. gonehuntingagain

    gonehuntingagain Well-Known Member

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    There are several options that you could consider.
    1) Get a varmint barrel (such as the on on the Rem VSLH) and have it fluted to shed some weight and have it 26" long.

    2) Use #1 above, but get a barrel with polygonal rifling, and have it shorter (like 22") which would eliminate the need to have it fluted.
    From what I understand, polygonal rifling gives you more velocity with a shorter barrel vs a longer barrel with standard rifling.

    3) You can usually order a barrel with whatever taper on it that you choose.

    I'm sure the other members will chime in and help steer you in a good direction. [​IMG]
     

  3. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Greenhorn,

    The 30-06 certainly shoots well out of a 26" barrel but it does not really need one.

    One thing to keep in mind with rifle barrels is that stiffness and rigidity are the key factors in accuracy after proper fitting of course.

    For every 2" increased in barrel length over 24", I like to increase the barrel contour by 1.

    For the minimum I like to use for big game rifles in a 30-06 class rifle would be a #4 in the 24" length.

    For the 26" barrels I would recommend going to a #5 and for the 28" barrels the #6 would be my choice.

    For the 30" barrels in .308" I like the #8 contour which is getting pretty heavy.

    Smaller calibes such as the .257"'s and 6.5mm can get by with one size smaller contour for equal barrel length and not give up much in stiffness and rigidity.

    Conversely, going up to a 338 class round, I would add a size in contour for each given barrel length to maintain the stiffness of the barrel.

    As far as pure accuracy goes, the shorter the barrel, for a given contour the stiffer and more rigid it will be. All else being equal, the shorter stiffer barrels will be more accurate then a longer barrel of same contour.

    This is why many 100 yard and 200 yard BR rifles are fitted with 20 and 22" barrels, they are very stiff and for pure accuracy, stiffness is far more important then high velocity.

    For long range shooting, we need a compromise of both. We want as much performance out of the round we are using but we also need the stiffness for fine accuracy and consistancy.

    Once a barrel get over 24", you really need to start adding barrel mass to keep groups tiny.

    Good Shooting, probably just made more questions for you instead of answering the ones you had.

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  4. marketello

    marketello Well-Known Member

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    Get a varmint barrel (such as the on on the Rem VSLH) and have it fluted to shed some weight and have it 26" long.

    I really liked the Rem .308 VLH but thought it would be too heavy to hunt, how mush weight would fluting take off the weight of the rifle?

    Thanks for the comebacks.
     
  5. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Generally fluting will cut the barrel weight by anywhere from .3 to .5 lbs depending on size of flutes and length of barrel.

    Good Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  6. Pete Lincoln

    Pete Lincoln Well-Known Member

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    you don't need any more than a 22" barrel on an 06.
    Pete
     
  7. wapiti13

    wapiti13 Well-Known Member

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    I agree that a 22" barrel will do the job on your 'o6. You can go to a stiffer barrel, but a # 3 is plenty heavy & a #2 would also work good, but will srart to wander as it heats up. Drop some weight in your stock but using a stable synthetic model. Go will a good brand that is pillar bedded and stiff (no injections). You can really lighten a rifle with something like a Lone Wolf stock and still have a very accurate rifle. Reloding technique, quality of barrel and chambering, and blue printing all come into play. Good luck.
     
  8. lee e. jurras

    lee e. jurras Well-Known Member

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    When you speak of a LR rifle and a walking around rifle, makes one ask what you call LR ?. When I hear 22" bbls and # 2 and # 3 taper I also wonder what calls LR ? A properly set up '06 is capable of 800 yard Whitetails in experienced hands.I'm not convinced you'll find it in a walking around rifle tho..IMHO [​IMG]
     
  9. marketello

    marketello Well-Known Member

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    Well Lee, you have me there, as the name suggests I am new to the game.

    Having my kids starting the college years I find myself working more Saturdays then I wish, so I am looking for a hobby to accent my saltwater fishing. The trouble with SW fishing is that you can't really do so after working half a day on Sat.

    What I mean by longrange would be a rifle that has the capacity to shoot as far and accurate as can be, and still be suitable on the shoulder for a long walk in the Sierras.

    I know there are more suited calibers for LR than the .06, but I also don't beleieve in shooting what I won't eat, so I really don't want something that will destroy meat.

    Reading this forum, and other webpages has given me plenty to think about, I think my first choise would be a .280 with a stiff barrel, and bedded reciever, and see how good i can get from there. After looking around, I'm not sure a .280 can be found in a lefty version, so that leaves me with a .270 or .06

    I really can't tell you what I mean by longrange, only time and practice will be able to answer that question. All I have is expectations, but I realize that I am green enough that my expectations might be modest, or very wishfull thinking.

    In all honesty my ambitions are to be accurate in the four firing positions more so than the bench. I realize that most hunters in those positions consider their range to be approx 300yds with an out of box rifle, so I would be thrilled to have a rifle that with pratice would allow me to be accurate up to 500 yds.

    [ 11-13-2004: Message edited by: Greenhorn ]
     
  10. Agunner012

    Agunner012 Well-Known Member

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    How about a 7mm Mag? Tons of factory ammo, and a little more HP than an 06.

    Andrew
     
  11. lee e. jurras

    lee e. jurras Well-Known Member

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    Well Greenhorn sounds like you are on the right track with your thinking and practiceing. Nothing wrong with the '06 for what you have in mind. In most cases practice is what is needed. LR can become in the eyes of the beholder.A 338/378 at 25-30 #'s off the bench, thats is one thing to one LR shooter and a 300 yd. kneeling shot across the canyon is something to another LR shooter. However, generally speaking when one thinks of LR shooting of BG it conjurs up thoughts of Prepped cases, match grade bullets, scopes of 15X and above, solid rests, plenty of trigger time and rangefinders to name but a few. All come after the initial start of training as you have outlined. Some use it as sport and or relaxation, others it becomes a way of life.Generally time and money will have an overall bearing. Sounds as tho you are on the right beginning track for whichever route you choose. Good shooting... [​IMG]
     
  12. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    Greenhorn

    50 & the other members are wright on.

    A walking around rifel is diffrent for a longrange hunter than a short range hunter.

    If your looking for 400 to 500rd shots dont worry about 2 or 3lbs .

    I have used mountain rifels [5 to 6 lbs]
    to heavy longrange rifels [12 to 15lbs] and
    liked the heavy best.

    Most hunters walk less than 5mi on a hunt so what,s 5 or 10lbs compaired to having
    a steady and accurate rifel.

    Taylor your rifel to your type of hunting
    not how far you walk.

    I allways have to laugh when some guy that
    drives his big S U V ,parks,walks around a 100rds to his stand and claims my 10lb rifel is to heavy.

    With out being crued if these guy,s would
    take a dump before going they could shave
    that 5lbs they worry so much about.

    Remember good shot placement and clean kills are what counts.

    J E [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  13. Ian M

    Ian M Well-Known Member

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    This is an interesting topic, particularly since I have also been interested in a lighter long range rifle. The rife that I am shooting is still being evolved into a final product and it is getting better with each change.
    Suggest you consider a GA Precision "Nontypical" as one possibility - matter of fact I believe it would be exactly what you need. Available in .270, 7mm and .300 WSM - any of these cartridges will kill out to the distances you are talking. Weight with scope is right at eight pounds. The GA rifle uses superb lightweight components, put together with the tricks used to build long range sniper rifles.
    Fact is there are other great smiths who could build you a rifle, George Gardner happens to be working on the lightweight longrange challenge right now and his rifles are a proven commodity.
    Since I got the lightweight rifle I have killed deer out past 700 yards - only problem I have is looking at the 15 pounders in the gunsafe that are not going on as many hunts anymore.
    There is a heading at the beggining of this site regarding the development of the GA rifle, George has built several now and he tells me he has standardized on the barrel now. He tried several suppliers, found one cut-rifled barrel maker that will supply superb shooters on very reasonable time frames.
    Good luck with this - remember that finding a light rifle is only part of the setup, you will also need a lightweight scope and mounts to make the system complete. I am using two scopes that fit the bill perfectlly - the 2.5-10 Nightforce NXS and the Leupold MK4 MRT 3-9. Both are about one pound, have superb optics and turrets. GA uses super lightweight Badger mounts, they are about as nice as it gets.
    You also must ensure that the stock used is stiff enough to allow the use of a Harris bipod, some light stocks flex and allow the barrel to contact in the channel which blows accuracy. The McMillan Hunters Edge is a carbon fibre stock that will do Harris's no sweat. Only available for the Rem. 700 - that is a shame as I would sure like to see one for the M-70, would make for a better WSM rifle.
    The '06 is a fine choice but the newer WSM cases are also worth considering - a 7mm WSM would do the job in fine style since there are lots of good bullet choices.
    Good luck, planning and thinking these things out is all part of the fun.

    [ 11-14-2004: Message edited by: Ian M ]

    [ 11-14-2004: Message edited by: Ian M ]
     
  14. Yogi

    Yogi Active Member

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    As Greenhorn has described his rifle objectives as well as his newness to the sport of "long range" hunting, I would have to say, "I'm basically in the same place"... I want a long range hunter that doesn't weigh a ton, yet can do 300, 400, 500, more(?). okay, yes, as far as I can confidently shoot. And I am VERY New to the sport.

    And yes I agree with some of the other posts that a 9-10 pound rifle is NOT horrible compared to a 7 pounder. It far more depends on how much fat your carrying, how in shape you are, and what else you are carrying (backpack etc) and how you're carrying it. (IMHO)...

    I started out a few weeks ago with a used Remington 700 in 300 Win Mag... Yet, I may re-consider and primarily set it up and use this rifle as a deer/bear hunter in Upstate NY's (Adirondack's) densely wooded country where 200 yard shots would be about max. But I'd want a rifle that can deliver some punch. But, NOT a 15 pound rifle.

    Overall, I find this thread extremely helpful and the parallels quite close, and would like to add in the mix of topics the 300 Win Mag in addition to the 30 06 and the 270, and 280. Or perhaps the Rem700 300 WinMag is NOT a rifle that any of the more seasoned people here would think is a good option for me or Greenhorn to consider for a good lightweight long range shooter. Knowing your thoughts on this may be useful to both of us (and others).

    The scope and base and mounts information is most valuable so far and I would really like some of you far more experienced to expound further on this: Light weight yet ideal for let's say 500 yard shots.

    And yes it is the planning and research and discussions like this that are half the fun. I was consdiering a 30-06 or a 300 WinMag, and the 300WM came up first at a great price. But I know that should NOT be a deciding factor. I want to set up a good light-to-moderate-weight riflew/scope for long range hunting, not TWO rifles.

    Thanks guys for this thread and discussion, I am learning important stuff.