Needed 6.5x284 deer load

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by markb1951, Apr 21, 2011.

  1. markb1951

    markb1951 Member

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    Like the title says what I need are suggestions for a good deer hunting load for use at 300 - 500 yards. To date I have only shot 123 Lapuas at steel and paper. As good as they shoot I have heard they act like FMJ's on deer. The plan as of now is using H4831 or H4350. The bullets will be either a Nosler 120 BT or Berger 130 Hunting VLD. If you have any opinions about either of these bullets....or any others you like, I would like to hear about them. Thanks, Mark
     
  2. Ernie

    Ernie SPONSOR

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    I use H-4350 and the 130 Berger-Works great
     

  3. cfvickers

    cfvickers Well-Known Member

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    51.8Gr Reloader 17, Berger 130VLD 3.195"OAL in my rifle, Fed 215 primer, 3200 FPS 1/2 inch groups at 200 yards all day, 0-5fps max spread depending on the weather. Only tested on deer to 320 yards by me, right behind the front shoulder DRT, no meat ruined as she was angling toward me just a hair. 1.5x3" exit wound on off side. Mine has a 26 inch barrel.
     
  4. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    there is a guy on 24hourcampfire - "scenarshooter" killed a ton of stuff with scenars out of three 308s. . i use 120 balistic tips and H-4350. i use the 123 for matches. re-17 good also.
     
  5. BlackKnight755

    BlackKnight755 Well-Known Member

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    Lapua brass, 49 grains of vhitavuori N160, Berger 140 VLD, CCI BR-2 primer= 2950 FPS out of my gun. I shoot a broughton 5C 32" barrel. I would go with the 140's if you have the twist rate for them for the higher BC, if your going to be shooting deer at 3-5 hundred yards, I would speculate that you are going to be shooting some open terrain of some sort. You are more likely to need to "cheat" the wind in that type of shooting situation verses shooting down a shooting lane and this is where the heavier bullets really shine. Just my two cents worth.
     
  6. cfvickers

    cfvickers Well-Known Member

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    at 500 yards the 130VLD launched at an easy to achieve 3100 fps in a 10 mph wind has around 1.75 inches less drop and .5 inch more wind drift than a 140VLD launched at an equally easy to achieve 3000 fps. I looked into this a lot when choosing my bullet and the 130 has an advantage at ranges inside about 600 yards. The BC of the 140 will make little difference given the velocity you can achieve with the 130. The 140 will have 4 inches less wind drift but drops 6 inches more than the 130 even at 1000 yards. Now, if you can get there, my top velocity with the 140 is 3120 and then it only has 2 inches more drop than the 130 at 3200 fps and at 1000 yards and still 4 inches less wind drift. Really the only advantage if you know what your bullet is going to do is just a little more down range energy giving you about an extra hundred yards of range with the 140. Maybe less.

    I chose by which one my gun liked better. That info is from the Berger ballistics calculator with the pre-entered atmospheric data. All was equal except the bullet weight, BC, and velocity. The velocity was entered from known achievable velocities in my rifle. Now, if you launch them both at the same velocity (you would not most likely) then yes, the 140 would have a significant advantage. But there is no need to slow the lighter bullet down just to say the other is going to be better. The 140 will reach the velocity of the 130 at about 600 yards or actually maybe 580 as it is 5 fps faster at 600. at 1000 yards the 140 is still carrying 50 fps more velocity, so it seems the BC of the 140 would not shine really untill beyond 900 or so yards where the 130 starts to fall off a little before the 140 does. When you are in to 550+ G1 or 280+ G7 BC range it takes quite a while for that extra 10 grains and .02 or so of ballistic coefficient to make a difference, where the velocity difference will show off at an earlier point and hold on till way out there.

    Edit: Just for giggles I put in atmospheric data for an average late fall day hunting in my area and got very similar results. I used a 200 yard zero for all of this data.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2011
  7. cfvickers

    cfvickers Well-Known Member

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    if you don't mind my asking, Why do you limit yourself at only 2950 fps in a hunting situation when you have a 32 inch barrel? And, if you know, why is my 26 inch barrel getting almost the exact same velocity as you are getting with 32 with the same load save the primer, I used fed 210 match. Very good load by the way! I can see limiting it for target use to preserve barrel life. But the wear you will get working up a hunting load to higher velocities will be minimal and can help some with wind drift at extreme ranges while stretching you maximum range. anyway, I was just under the impression that velocity was the main reason for the longer barrels. I can get 2950 quite easily with my 23 inch barrel 6.5-284. Not criticizing, I am just asking seriously.
     
  8. BlackKnight755

    BlackKnight755 Well-Known Member

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    This is a competition load that I tried on deer to find that they are deer KILLERS! I didnt try to go to max velocities because I already have all the load/range data for this particular load and it is a proven winner at lower velocities than 3000. Thats the reason that I don't try/need to get it to run faster. the only difference in my loads are competition is loaded with a pointed bullet and the hunting round is not. I trim all the meplats, both hunting and competition, then point the competition bullets. If I need a speed demon/flat shooter or if I am going for larger game, I have a 300 RUM that is runing 3970 fps that shoots 14 moa to a thousand yards.
     
  9. BlackKnight755

    BlackKnight755 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I forgot to answer your question as to the why my 32'' barrel and your 26" barrel are running about the same fps, and the answer is I don't really know. It could be the difference in the OAL, how the bullet is situated in the bore (seated in the lands or jumping) or even the difference in the chamber and or the neck. I guess it could be one or more of many different variables.

    Without sitting down with both rifles and measuring the chambers on both I couldn't really even begin to guess the reason though. I guess yours is just one of the chamber dimension combinations that really works out of what is a a short barrel to me.

    ...Also I just went back and read the info and data that you posted about the 130 berger vs the 140 berger and you were stating the 140 had around 4" less wind drift than the 130. Thats another reason that I chose the 140, if I am able to "cheat" the wind out of 4" of drift then all the better. I have always been more concerned about the windage more so than the elevation. I can always put another couple of clicks in the elevation for a known yardage and I may not have to be as worried about being spot on when it comes to guessing the wind speed and direction.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2011
  10. cfvickers

    cfvickers Well-Known Member

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    Good enouigh. I didn't want to come across like a smarta$$ . I had just compared the two a good bit before I settled on the 130 to ensure I was comfortable with the difference.
     
  11. markb1951

    markb1951 Member

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    The rifle has a 26" barrel and is a 8 twist so stability won't be a problem with either bullet. The situation is I hunt from a hut and the creek is 475 with the trees they come out of is at 650. The deer hang around the area in between. I'm not concerned with the drop as I have mapped out fence posts, trees, etc. so the all distances are known to within 5 yards. My thoughts are that most bullet makers used 1800 fps as the minimum so I wanted to narrow the bullet choices down to just a couple before working up the loads. Thanks to you guys it will be Berger's with RL17, N160 or my current powder H4350.
     
  12. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    having shot a lot of rounds in competition at 600 yards; practice can give you the confidence to make those shots.
     
  13. BlackKnight755

    BlackKnight755 Well-Known Member

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    Mark,

    Sorry if it seemed that we were hijacking the original thread subject but maybe you were able to extract some useful information from what CSV and I were talking about.

    Like I was saying, the main reason that I use the 140's is that I have all my load and range data from the competition load. I could work up a load with the 130's but I have put in many long hours with the 140's and I just chose to use them. I know where they are going and I know what they will do when they get there.

    To put it in simple form, and I think that CSV will agree, more velocity/flatter trajectory with the 130's out to the yardage that you have stated. Wind drift difference is not going to be that big a deal at the shorter yardage but out past the 600 yard line the 140's will have a slight advantage over the 130's in the wind.

    All in all both the 130's and the 140's are great bullets and I don't think that you will have any problems with either. I think that the deer that you shoot will be DRT with good shot placement.

    Good shooting and again I hope that you have gotten some useful information, BK.
     
  14. cfvickers

    cfvickers Well-Known Member

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    I have killed deer with both the 130 and the 140 and of five, none have taken another step. they all fell dead in their tracks. Like I said my longest shot was 320 yards but that was with the 130 and I still had a complete pass through.with significant energy dumped into the animal. the closer they are the larger the exit wound, so I would suggest rib cage shots. They have worked very well for me. You just can't beat 6.5s in general for deer. And yes, I do agree that the advantage of the 140 will show at past 600 yards.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2011