Need some advice toward my 270 upgrade

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by Bearhyde, Jul 18, 2009.

  1. Bearhyde

    Bearhyde Member

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    Hello to all the long range hunters out there.
    This is my first post but I am a long time observer.

    I have a nice Rem 700 BDL Custom Deluxe in 270 Win that I will be upgrading.
    This will not be a complete custom build from scratch.
    (I have a different caliber in mind for that future project.)
    My application is medium to long range whitetail hunting - maximum 500 yards.
    On a good day under perfect conditions this rifle shoots 2" groups at 100 yards with factory 130 or 140 grain ammo.
    I figure that is better than average accuracy for an off the shelf rifle.
    I want to fine tune what I consider to be an exceptional factory rifle so that I can trust an ethical call when the longer shots present themselves.
    This particular rifle seems to be a good platform to start out with.

    I will be reloading my own ammo after I'm satisfied with the bullet delivery system...
    I already have an excellent scope.
    So far I've had a recoil pad installed on the factory walnut stock (which I prefer).
    I also replaced the horrible factory trigger with a Jewell varminter top safety trigger.
    I would like to hear from any of you out there that have also upgraded your model 700.
    My stock barrel has seen maybe 100 rounds but I would like to know who makes a really decent barrel - I am prepared to invest in a good one.
    Also would appreciate an informed opinion on optimal barrel length and contour.
    I do not care for the factory ISS (integrated security system) that my bolt was wearing Xmas morning and the lock time seems kinda "slow".
    Should I replace the entire bolt or maybe just get a new firing pin assembly?
    Would it be wise to bed the action now or after I get a new barrel?
    Please feel free to mention ANYTHING no matter how obvious that I should consider beyond the upgrades I have mentioned above.
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. CliffM

    CliffM Well-Known Member

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    If you are stuck on having the wood stock don't be afraid of getting some air between the barrel and the stock. The ones I have been around all had some degree of twist in them and really needed to be free floated to get them to shoot well. Pillar bedding would be on the list to get away from the seasonal shrinking and swelling of the wood. With tailored loads they have all shot 3/4moa or under.
    Cliff
     

  3. dwm

    dwm Well-Known Member

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    I would have to agree with CliffM, if you like the wood stock, have it pillar bedded and free float the barrel. A factory REM700 with a good trigger and decent stock can be quite accurate even with the factory barrel.

    Since it sounds like you are new to reloading, I would go ahead and do that next. Get yourself setup with a press, dies, scale, etc. and work up some good loads for the .270. Then practice shooting. With good handloads it may be possible to bring the group size well under 1MOA, maybe even 1/2 MOA.

    I think you may be surprised, the .270 is a very capable round. There is no reason it wouldn't be able to take whitetails out to 500 yds.

    When you get a good feel for reloading and have outgrown the .270 or find that the factory barrel just won't shoot any better, then rebarrel to something different.

    A medium to heavy barrel, Sendero profile, or something like that, with a stock that has a wider fore end may be easier to shoot small groups at longer distances with. I don't know that I would do that first though, there may be a lot of good shooting in what you have already.

    My opinion, others will vary ...
     
  4. angus-5024

    angus-5024 Well-Known Member

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    +1 for eveything that dwm said. Definatly pillar bed it and free float the barrel alot. dont throw the factory barrel out until you have tried to hand load for it. most factory rifles I have had could shoot under 1moa with a little lovin' (though I havent had that many rifles). If you do relpace the barrel I would get something in the medium weight, just because I think that walnut with a heavy barrel looks funny. If you want to go heavy, get a joe russo laminate stock to go with it, they look awsome. I always try to keep my garranteed kill zone in the 8" mark so I would want a 1.5 MOA rifle to be confident at that distance.
     
  5. trebark

    trebark Well-Known Member

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    Bearhyde:
    You've gotten some good advice here and i'm going to repeat some of it....

    1. pillar bed and skim coat the stock.
    2. free float the barrel
    3. tune your trigger to 3lbs or less (your preference)

    While your rifle is at the gunsmith, start reloading your ammo.

    When your rifle comes back, take it out for some test shooting.

    I will have to respectfully disagree with angus on 1.5moa being acceptable accuracy. Generally speaking, your hunting accuracy is not as good as your bench shooting accuracy. Keeping that in mind, I would recommend you find a load that will shoot .75moa or better (.5moa would be great and not outside the realm of possibility).

    If you're going to rebarrel your rifle that opens up many many possibilities. You will first want to decide how you will use the rifle. It sounds as though you will want a rifle that is a 'carry' rifle. If that is the case you will not really want to exceed 10lbs with 9lbs being better. I'm 42 and in great shape and 9lbs is all I want to carry all day. My 12lb rifle is pretty much for setting up here and shooting waaaay over there.

    So, accepting that you want to build a carry rifle - to rebarrel the rifle I would suggest you go with a slightly different caliber than 270. The 280 comes to mind. I think that one of my rifles would be a good model for what I would recommend to you..... http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f53/my-280-updated-32771/
     
  6. angus-5024

    angus-5024 Well-Known Member

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    280fan,
    I totally agree that it is better to have .75 MOA for accuracy. The tighter the better. What I was trying to say was that if he was able to hit an 8" plate @ 500yards Every time in field conditions that it would be bare minimum for a shot that long. For me personally, If the rifle does not shoot under 1 MOA it doesnt get used. I simply took 8" and divided by 5 (roughly) to get the 1.5 Minimum (it actually 1.6). I should have included that in my original post. I stand corrected. I guess that if I'm gonna post I should do it right the first time:rolleyes:.
    +1 on the trigger and +1 on the 280 if you rebarrel.
     
  7. trueblue

    trueblue Well-Known Member

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    Any caliber from 25-06 to the 7mm RM would be fine. The 270 is a great caliber.
    2" groups at 100yards is not acceptable accuracy for taking 500 yard shots.
    I would do what others have previously mentioned, but the most important item in my mind is a top quality custom barrel. Then I would have a gunsmith do a basic truing to the action and start shooting.
    I would go with a 24" barrel in a # 4 contour, not to heavy, or #5 at the most for a carry rifle.
    Learning to reload is a big factor in accuracy also.
    Bed your action in the wood stock with Devcon steel putty, and freefloat the barrel with at least 0.20 clearance.
    Good luck!
     
  8. Bearhyde

    Bearhyde Member

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    270 cal is my preferred deer cartridge.
    I deer hunt the extreme NE corner of the South Dakota coulee country near Sisseton.
    We walk for miles each and every day for most of the month of November.
    This will continue to be my daily carry deer rifle so I want the weight to remain below 10 pounds.
    I know there are better ballistics and bullet choices available with other calibers out there but I am determined to own a fine shooter in 270 Win.
    I want to squeeze some more accuracy out of it for those 400 - 500 yard shots at broadside trophy bucks I pass on each year due to the limitations of the rifle and factory ammo.
    I won't have the time to set up a reloading bench this year with Minnesota bear baiting on the horizon so I will be shooting Hornady & Black Hills ammo for one more hunting season.
    In the mean time I will be putting all of your advice to work toward accurizing my deer rifle.
    Who makes a top quality custom barrel for my medium to long range application?
    There are a lot to choose from - each one claiming to be the best for one reason or other.
    I figure you guys would know from experience.
    Any advice on my bolt concerns?


    Thanks largely to this forum I'm already pondering caliber choices for an extreme long range custom rifle in the future.
    (I still can't believe the impressive distances you guys routinely talk about.)
    There are a number of perfect sniping spots in our area that I plan on packing a heavier long range rifle into in the future.
     
  9. trebark

    trebark Well-Known Member

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    Clearly you're married to the .270, but I will try one more time...if you're going to rebarrel your gun consider the MANY great 7mm choices...280Rem, 280AI. If I had to do it over again, I'd have chosen 280AI for my carry rifle. It has similar ballistics to the 7mm Mag, but without the recoil.


    Personally, I chose Hart Rifle Barrels in New York Hart Rifle Barrels They have a great reputation and they will make your barrel and install it for you.

    There are some other companies that make great barrels - Kreiger, Broughton, Shilen. Although I'm not certain, these companies will make the barrel for you, then you will have to get a gunsmith to do the install.

    If you plan to have your rifle rebarreled for this coming hunting season, get on this project quick. Hart turned my project around fairly quickly and that took four months.

    Here's a question I'll leave to one of the gunsmiths on this board as I don't have much experience in remedying this type of issue.

    Welcome to the addiction! There's no known cure. All you can do is mitigate withdrawal symptoms with regular shooting and continuous acquisition of more rifles.
     
  10. X3MHunter

    X3MHunter Well-Known Member

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    +1 on the 280 Ackley Improved. It has ballistics close to the 7mm Mag. with less powder and less recoil, and it headspaces off the sholder, not the belt! Another plus for the 280 AI is that you can buy brass from Nosler, no fireforming needed!

    Mine is built on a Rem. 700 action with a 26" 1:8 Bartlein barrel and a H-S Stock. It really likes the 160 Nosler Accubonds, it shoots under 1/4MOA, great shooting rifle. It also likes 175 MatchKings.

    But I would try to make the factory barrel shoot first, not uncommon to get 3/4 MOA or better. Then consider rebarreling.

    X3M
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2009
  11. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    I would recomend a 280 rem because it would work in your action with out any changes
    and would be almost the same in felt recoil ,Plus the 7mm bullets have a better ballistic coefficient than the .277 because of the number of bullets and the popularity of the 7mm
    calibers.

    Don't get me wrong the first 600yard match that I won was with a 270 win and hunting bullets
    because they didn't make match bullets.

    As far as custom barrels any one will out perform the factory barrels. some to look at are Lilja,
    Hart,Shillen,keiger and Brux just to name a few.

    As far as barrel weight I would recomend one the same contour as your factory barrel or one size larger.

    Pillar bedding and a new trigger will help and you can replace the stock firing pin with a speed
    lock but it's not nessary because the J lock only locks the firing pin to the shroud and when
    locked opened does not slow down the firing pin.

    Something to think about

    J E CUSTOM
     
  12. Jamie6.5

    Jamie6.5 Well-Known Member

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    If you want to stay with the .270:
    The advice here on bedding/truing/floating etc. is all good, but!!

    Start working up a load with the higher BC 150gr bullets. Better retained velocity.
    Find out how deep YOUR rifle's throat is and tweak the COL until you find which depth yours likes, and hope it will fit in the magazine.
    Many factory .270s are throated to accept the 160gr round nosed slugs and have throats that are way deeper than practical. This is probably contributing to your 2" groups (with 130gr?) @100. Some bullets/loads like to jump, others don't.
    Then if you find you're not getting the velocity/accuracy combo out of it you want, you might try having the chamber Ackley'd. Then you get to start over on your load workup.

    If you do rebarrel, I agree with the above, go with the .280AI.
     
  13. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    krieger barrel the fatter the better. free float it
     
  14. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    i did not read all the posts. a hart barrel would be good too. my kriegers all shoot everything good. 1/2 min. you don't have to fuss around with loads. just load and shoot. my rem 700 factory barrel 7mm shoots one load .6-.7. 2" is not enough accuracy for 500 yard shots. once you get less than an inch at 100 try some groups at 400 and 500.