need EVERYone's advice on gear

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by izzykareem, Mar 4, 2005.

  1. izzykareem

    izzykareem Member

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    need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    hey guys,

    I am not new to hunting, hunted since i was 12. My dad has always bought me Rem 700 .270's and I've shot out to 200 or so yards.

    NOW!!!
    I really want to start shooting some serious long range. And by long range i am willing to practice as much as it takes to shoot further and further; 1500 yds and beyond.

    So, what i would like is advice on gun makers, calibers, optics, hand-loading, custom components like barrels,triggers, etc. Pros and Cons for each. maybe there is a section on this website where this is already detailed but i haven't seen it.

    On a side note, this will be both for hunting big to small-game and for target shooting. I don't mind heavy guns at all as a matter of fact i prefer them. Just so much more stable at long distances. So a well rounded firearm.

    Please, commence with the ideas God willing.
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    1500 yards is a L O N G way ...... it is a bunch of fun but to get there you need alot of time and practice.....

    I'm gonna tell you what many will.. and I a m not saying it I didi it right .. I learned the hard way....

    I jumped right in a bought a wildcat caliber to "learn to shoot " long range.. really bad idea.... as time went on I realized that I needed to get the basics first...

    to learn ballistics and trajectories and the priciples of lr shooting and hunting.... I feel there is a caliber that best suits this to "learn on"

    quite simply a .308 Winchester....

    why.. very easy to reload for and learn the basics of relaoding.. ALOT of components out there to choose from...
    highly versitle caliber to reload for.. from Varmints to Deer....

    I recomend a "tactical" of sorts set up initially... a sturdy heavier rifle....

    there are lots of variations it all depends on what you like...

    Stocks....I prefer the A series from Mc Millan.....

    Barrels I have Mike Rock but Broughton seems to be creating quite a following....

    Rem 700 actions are easy for any smith to get to shoot accurately....

    for what I do.. I like Badger rings, bases and bottom metal...

    Optics... Lupy is the starting point for most people and make reliable consistient stuff for the money spent...

    I am sure you'll get many answers.... but I think that's the basics...

    I seriously recommend the 308 to "learn" on then once you have the "knowledge under your belt.. "banch" out from there......
     

  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    The lack of match quality low drag bullets for the 270 leaves this one out. The 25-06 has only one vld bullet available Berger 115gr with a BC of.522.In my Ruger KM77VT it will shoot 3300fps with a stout load of vhit N165 Fed.GM215.It works for me for any thing out to 12 to 1300yds.Elevation here 5000 ,and have shot it at 11000 in the high country. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
     
  4. Michael Eichele

    Michael Eichele Well-Known Member

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    Ric summed it up very nice.

    I too jumped in head first with a wild cat (at the time) It was the 30-378 Wby mag. That was a really bad idea. I never hunted with it and then sold it. I went to the 308 win and to this day its my favorate case. 1500 yards is way out there even for seasoned shooters. I would recomend the goal of 1500 yards to be a few years off. Start at 300 or 400 and gradualy work up from there. The 300 RUM and 338 LM and wild cats along the same lines as those factory rounds can handle 1500 yards nicley

    As far as gear, for a beginner there is nothing wrong with a factory rifle. The 700's are a favoraite of many LR shooters. The Savages are also popular. When you cant shoot any farther than your factory 308 can, then go with a custom rifle in a bigger class of your well researched choice. It is very possible to shoot 1K with a factory 308.

    Bi-pods make a huge differance as well as a rear stabilizer. DO NOT underestimate the value of quality scopes.
     
  5. abinok

    abinok Writers Guild

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    I tend to follow the opinions of the previous posters, with a couple of exceptions.
    If you don't handload, or aren't going to for a while, the 308 is a great choice. you might also consider the 260 Rem or the 7mm08. Both of these cases will drive bullets with high BCs very fast. I believe that they are ballistically superior to the 308.
    That being said, my first longrange gun was a (and my primary gun remains to be) a 300WM. I might get flamed for this, but I have long maintained that the 300WM is the most versitle cartridges ever created***disclaimer*** if you handload. With the 220SMK, the 300WM will do 1500 and more, but is easy to load down to 308Win velocities with the same bullet weight. Just because your Ferrari will do 260mph, don't mean you have to drive it that fast. The load that I did my "learning" on was a 175SMK driven to 2670 (basically duplicating 308 velocity.) Not long after that, my 300WM started edging into my 22lr's job too. The varmit hunting that was once done with my mossberg 22 rifle, is now done by a 90gr Hornady xtp pistol bullet over a reduced load of SR 4759 at 1860fps.
    I like to get all the use I can out of that expensive scope, trigger, stock ect...
    There are many claimed drawbacks to the 300wm.
    Barrel life is less than the 308, but not by a lot if you don't open the throttle all the time. My current barrel has 1412rds of full power ammo, 370rds of "308" class ammo, and 720rds of my 90gr loads fired through it. My last LR group, a few days ago was 3shots in 8.5" at 1350yds.
    Recoil is also heavier than 308, even when using loads generating 308 velocities, but the differance is only really on paper with heavy rifles. Ive never notticed the diferance.
    One final thought, decide what you are going to do with the gun, and make some realistic predictions about what purpose it will serve. I know people with $6000 custom rifles that set in the safe 364 days out of the year because they are too specialized to use or practice with regularly. Its possible to build or buy a no compromise 100-1500yd rifle, it just won't be chambered for the .338thermonuclearnitroloudenboomer.
    Be conservative, and start handloading asap.
     
  6. trader388

    trader388 Well-Known Member

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    Holy group batman! Show us a pic!!! Tell us about your stick...what kind of barrel, twist, contour etc? On a remmy action? What kind of optics do you use?
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    I'm gonna have to dis-agree a bit.. for a guy learning the basics and learning to reload....

    I'd stay away from belted magnums....

    you could always go 30'06.....

    I still think anyway you slice it.. the 308 is the all around .....
     
  8. abinok

    abinok Writers Guild

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    trader,
    My rifle is a Savage 112BVSS.
    Factory Barrel, 26" 1:10, factory heavy contour.
    Recoil lug from sharpshooters supply.
    Trigger work done by Chris V. At h and H gunrange in OKC.
    There are a few modifications to my stock, for position shooting.
    I use a Millet 6-25X56, 30mm tube with mildot. It is mated to my rifle with millet angle lock rings, and a Ken Farrell 20 MOA base. With this setup I have shot beyond 1600yds.
    The group I mentioned is already posted under the third page of the following link:
    http://longrangehunting.com/ubbthreads/s...e=1&fpart=1
    As mentioned in this thread, this group, and most I shoot at this distance is shot from a harris bipod.
     
  9. trader388

    trader388 Well-Known Member

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    Hmm... I think the BS meter is running pretty high right now.
     
  10. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    Bear my friend,

    Your living in yesteryear. I have 600 169.5 gr ULD RBBT Wildcat bullets sitting here for the 270s with a B.C. of .748. Last I looked this was superior to a 240 gr .308" Sierra Matchking.

    Also on the 257 front, Wildcat Bullets is also taking the lead with this calliber. There are 130 gr FBHP with a B.C. in the .550 range, a 142 gr ULD RBBT with a B.C. of .800 and a huge 156 gr ULD RBBT with a B.C. in the .830 range, yes, better then the 300 gr Sierra .338" Matchking.

    Your load is a great load obviously but there are new bullets out there that make the Bergers look kind of silly when it comes to ballistic performance. Just have to use the proper twist barrel and Lilja will very soon be tooled up for the 1-7 twist, 3 groove 257" barrels.

    Good Shooting

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    abinok....

    factory stick except for trigger shooting 8" group at 1350 yards....

    you have 1412 FULL POWER WM rounds down the tube and a total of 2502 rounds....

    OK I belive in alot of things but I am having a HARD time beliveing this....

    most 300WM tubes are good for 1500 rounds .... then accuracy usually goes south.....

    you have 1000 more down it... reguardless if they were reduced loads or not.... wear is wear....

    you must have the mother of all savages rifles not to mention factory tubes....

    sorry man.... I just can't seem to choke this one down....

    If I am wrong I appologize openly and publicly...
     
  12. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    Adinok,

    That is a HELL of a group, I am not saying it did not happen as if you say it did I would not question that but the odds of it happening are extremely low. Was this group with your reduced loads.

    Lsat I checked the Millet really had limited veritcal elevation adjustment range, so much though that even with a 20 moa bass it would be hard pressed to reach 1500 yards with full tilt 300 Win Mag loads. You must have been using the lower mild dots for aiming points for past 1600 yard shooting.

    Anyway, what is your averge group size at this range. If your holding honest 1 moa group averages at 1000 yards or beyond, you better get to every 1000 yard BR match you can because you will win everyone or at least be very competitive.

    That puts it into perspective how amazing that shot is that you made.

    Good Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  13. izzykareem

    izzykareem Member

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    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    i would really like to thank all those who gave advice especially those who went in depth into gear. For the record, I know that I can't walk out tomorrow and shoot 1500 yds, i know it will take alot of practice which is why I said in my original request that i wanted a very versatile gun, something i wouldn't waste my money on as i learn and in the meantime continue to hunt within my limits of yardage/meterage.

    so is the consensus of the responders then a .308, may i also ask what people think of the new .270 short action. Also, right now i have a .270 model 700, is there anything i can do to long-range-ize it? For the .308, what make and model. I would also ask that people not use abbreviations because I don't know what the mean: like BC or MKS, etc. It will just save questions in the future. thanks again. i love experts, they always have the best answers.
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Re: need EVERYone\'s advice on gear

    270
    You have no clue what you just got yourself into!! Start savin every cent you have because you will become hooked real fast. I love this place and what I have learned here. These guys are the greatest. I have bought several rifles since being on this site and have one on the way..The dream gun I call it.

    Enjoy and learn

    Joe