Most accurate .30 cal, 200 gr. + HUNTING bullet??

[MMERSS]

T
The excellent Berger pills combined with the BOSS brake should make for excellent accuracy.

Good luck! I hope the combo works out for you.

Perhaps consider taking your competition rifle with the 230's on a hunt if deemed acceptable. If the gun/ammo is good enough for competition isn't a hunt good enough for the gun and ammo?

FWIW, I try to implement the same principles in competition to include the equipment as much as possible during a hunt. If something works well in competition why not do the same during a hunt while being as practical as possible? Currently my 300 RUM shoots the 230 Hybrid on it's hunting adventures (not a competition gun but the scope, bipod and bags are used in competition). The hybrid target is not an advertised hunting bullet but the most accurate out there from what I have found so far. Under the right conditions and shot placement the hybrids have a great record, to include the 215's. I'm betting Berger will be making the Hunting Hybrid 230's and 215's in the future. Loading for a season or two with the current target hybrids will make the transition effortless when the new HH line hits the market.

 

[bigngreen]

From what I've seen on game from the 210 hunting, the 215 and the 230 Hybrid I would hunt the 210 last if I had to, still good but the 215 and 230 are better on game IMO. The designations have more to do with marketing than the actual ability of the bullet, I for one would not shoot a thinner jacketed "hunting" version of the 230 and especially the 215 for hunting!

 

[Broz]

These days the designations on the label mean little to me. What I find more important are these factors.

Which bullet can I place the best? This also includes BC and which will drift the least from wind or other environmental conditions.

How does it perform in game when placed well in conjunction to the way I hunt? Also to include terminal damage and wound channel and how far the animals can travel after shot. I want them down and do not want them to leave the immediate area. Especially when they may have a 1000 yard or more head start.

How many have taken a second shot? Follow ups are always a part of our plan if needed but I can not honestly remember the last time we needed one. Sometimes this might not be so easy if the animal is not hit hard enough to hold him to the immediate area. Maybe we are lucky , maybe not, but my 300 win is at 22 and 0 for one shot first round kills on big game from 200 yards to 1285. All this with a bullet label that says "Target"

So I only consider the bullets I shoot at targets to be "target bullets". The ones I choose to hunt with may not say "premium hunting" on the box, but yet they are labeled by me as "premium killing" bullets. Only after they prove to do the jobs I need them to do when I do my part.

No bullet is perfect at all distances or under all circumstances. Most labeled "premium hunting" were intended for use at closer distances than many of us hunt. Some may not expand when used as a long range hunting bullet. Maybe we should label those as "reusable premium bullets" ?

Find what your gun likes, and what will give you the best odds to place in the vitals under any situations. Then understand how it works best to your personal advantage. Stack the odds in your favor, practice, and do your part and enjoy the table fare.

That my 2 cents, for what it worth.

Have a great hunting or target season!

Jeff

 

[Timber338]

I am fully expecting and hoping that Berger come up with a whole line of "Elite Hunter" hybrid hunting bullets. Obviously will include the .308 215 and 230's already marketed differently, and include more bullet weights so others with different cartridges can hunt with the hybrid design bullets as well. Have a good day, gents!

 

[Broz]

Also, if it is researched as to the actual difference in jacket thickness between bullets labeled "hunting" and "Target" one might be surprised at its slightness. The difference is so small in my opinion it is soon lost or overcome by impact velocity. I believe the ever so slightly "thicker" jackets of the bullets labeled "Target", is a difference that is there to allow less deformation while still in the tube in front of some aggressive twist rates and fast burning powders. A difference most will not even notice and may not fully understand. A difference that will not even be a factor in many rifles. Yet we put so much trust into labeling to make us feel better. A better trust might be found elsewhere involving particular rifle accuracy at distance, impact velocity, and placement to best work with the impact velocity and sectional density. Some might find this shocking, but in todays large magnum hunting rifles with the velocity, along with the actual real world average distance for most kills, the bullets labeled "Target" might just be the best choice for hunting. Especially if one chooses to enter through some bone.

This is only my opinion formed after killing many elk, deer and antelope and documenting bullet results and performances in my rifles.

Jeff

 

[Litehiker]

HUNTING BULLETS V.S. MATCH BULLETS

After shooting a spring turkey in PA years ago and having 69 gr. Sierra match the bullet pass through its breast and seeing the tom get away I no longer use match bullets for hunting.

(The next fall during archery season a hunter stopped me and told me he had shot "my" tom! His taxidermist told him about the thru-and-thru breast shot he saw. The hunter remembered me bitching back at the nearby ski lodge about hitting the turkey but having it run away. What a coinky-dink! Two guys shot the same turkey in two different seasons.)

Hollow point match bullets are approved under the Geneva Convention for use as sniper rounds because they do NOT open up and so I doubt very much if any Berger Tactical bullets would do for hunting. Their hollow point does not extend back to the lead core.

 

[gohring3006]

I doubt that any bullet hitting a turkeys breast would open up without hitting bone with the exception of maybe varmint bullets, (varmint grenade,VMax etc.) this gentleman is looking for 200grn.+ bullets that are effective for hunting. I doubt very much that he is hunting turkeys or varmints. Broz is the authority on this subject.( in my opinion ) so if he recommended a particular bullet you should listen, because his advise is coming from real world testing at all ranges and velocities, but hey its just advice, do what ever you want....

 

[Timber338]

I doubt that any bullet hitting a turkeys breast would open up without hitting bone with the exception of maybe varmint bullets, (varmint grenade,VMax etc.) this gentleman is looking for 200grn.+ bullets that are effective for hunting. I doubt very much that he is hunting turkeys or varmints. Broz is the authority on this subject.( in my opinion ) so if he recommended a particular bullet you should listen, because his advise is coming from real world testing at all ranges and velocities, but hey its just advice, do what ever you want....

+1. I totally agree with this.

 

[Broz]

HUNTING BULLETS V.S. MATCH BULLETS

so I doubt very much if any Berger Tactical bullets would do for hunting. Their hollow point does not extend back to the lead core.

This is simply speculation and is not true at all. I suggest you research further before making uneducated statements like this. You are wrong.

Oh, then go tell this Bull elk that was shot by my wife at 765 yards he is not dead and the Berger Tactical bullet he was shot with does not expand at all.

Jeff

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[Broz]

Post number 56 of the thread another forum member offered you read shows a sectioned 210 gr Berger Hunting bullet along side a 215 Tactical bullet. Both show the hollow point does extend to the lead and the huge difference and why I believe the Tactical hybrid expands better.

Here:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/comparing-berger-210-vld-215-hybrid-88657/index8.html


This thread also shows terminal documentation of 20 big game kills with a 300 win and the 215 Hybrid Tactical bullet you need to learn about.

Maybe it is of interest if you really want to know what you are shooting and how it will react when introduced into game at different impact velocities. Or you could ignore it again and go on making wrong statements and continue to be another misinformed hunter. Your choice.

Good luck.

Jeff

 

[Timber338]

I really think the design (and marketing) of the 210 hunting and the 215 hybrid bullets are a function of a smaller sized company like Berger doing their best to ethically put out good products. They had not tested the 215 as a hunting bullet. So they did not market it as such. We are in this unique setting where the end users are doing more testing than the company itself, and it's just taking time for the company to update their product marketing accordingly. And I'm sure they will verify the results on their own as well. There will always be people who put full value in names and marketing and trust nothing else. Then there are the leaders who figure out what works for themselves, and luckily, pass the information along, based on real hard technical data and field experience. Thanks again Jeff for re-posting your experience. I'm just waiting for some 215's to show up.

 

[Broz]

You are more than welcome Timber and I agree with your post. Also please understand it does not matter to me what anyone prefers to use. Unless I will be doing the retrieval or tracking. But the older I get the more it bothers be when I read internet posts that are not factually true. I only put forth whatI use and test results for other to decide if the results will work for them. And in an effort to put solid info out for those willing to review it.

Jeff

 

[bigngreen]

If I recall right the OTM designation allows for military applications if Berger also marketed the same bullet as a hunting design then no military contracts for said bullet.

 

[dana bodnar]

Nice hole in that bull , I love the bergers but I have a nice savage model 111 LRH that will not shoot them no matter how I build the load but I't likes 178-g A-max. Has anyone devloped a load yet for 300 win mag with the 208-g A-max yet. If so your imput would be helpful . THX Dana gun)