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Discussion in 'Long Range Scopes and Other Optics' started by Bill Maylor, Aug 15, 2008.
Which system is easier to use in the field.
The one that's easier to use in the field is the one you like the best and have practiced with the most. Both can work equally well, it's a matter of preference. What's most helpful is that the reticle and knobs match, be they Mil or MOA.
My preference is for Mils for several reasons. I like the click value size of .1 Mil for what I do, right in between 1/4 and 1/2 MOA and being in decimal form it makes for a nice svelte dropcharts as everything is pretty much two simple digits (3.7 Mils instead of 12.75 or 12 3/4 or 12+3 MOA for example) until you get to crazy ranges:
Another thing is just how common Mildot scopes and spotters are vs. MOA--you'll be compatible with more people spotting for you when you can take corrections in Mils (not even counting military). It's pretty universal.
But like I said, that's just my preference. There's nothing keeping MOA combos from working just as well. Getting comfortable with a system and practicing with it is more important than which one it is.
Yeah, what Jon said...
The problem is getting a mil on mil scope or a true moa on moa scope. They are there if you can afford them. Until I got the FFP IOR it has always been mildots with moa adjustments. I prefer the mil/mil. Now it is gonna be hard to go back, but I must because I just broke my second one and I don't think my wife will go for another $700 on top of the $1500 spent on the IOR. Like Jon said, it's all preference.
Thanks guys for some info. the reason why I asked is, I ordered a NF with the NP-R1. Each vertl. mark is 1" at 100yrds , Ithink 1 mil=3.6" at 100yrds. The power must be set at 22 power to make this est. I have a Burris with Mil Dots, and a Leupold with 1/4"ajustments at 100. Thay bouth shoot well, and until now I realy did not pay It much mind. I am rescopeing my 300RUM. Their must be a reason why thay make both? Bill Maylor
I think MOA math is easier for ranging. Just take the size of target and divide by the number of MOA's it's subtends then multiply by 100.
So say you see a mule deer, which average 18" from bottom of chest to top of back, and this measures 3.7 MOA's in your scope. Divide 18 by 3.7. You get 4.86. Your range is 486 yards. Of course, the farther the animal, the less accurate it becomes. If your rangefinder is forgotten back in the truck, this method would work in a pinch.
If you have a good drop chart and rangefinder... then I think both work equally well.
There is a reason why they make both...different strokes for different folks. If you ask me it's that simple.
If you are trying to go from using moa to mil or vice versa it takes some getting used to. Both work equally well in the hands of somebody that knows his system. I can't believe it has taken most manufacturers this long to realize the benefit of having things match up.
It really doesn't take any getting used to IMHO. I have used MOA scopes for years and I just bought a S&B with a Mill reticle and Mill turrets and all you need to know is how many of them that you need. I do like the Mill set up very much.
IMHO JonA laid it out very well.
The NP-R1 provides 1MOA gradients, not 1"per hundred yards.
The scope is MOA in adjustments as well.
It's MOA, why complicate it?
If you set up your dropchart in 'clicks' for elevation, things are easy as it gets.
The same reason they make Ford, Chevy and Dodge
Mikecr, thanks for the reply. Ihave been shooting rifles for apx 16 yrs. Befor that it was a shotgun state. I dont even know if my shotgun even works anymore. I dont know enough about MOA or MIL, drop charts or dope charts, but I am hungry to learn more. I have learn more about long distance shooting on this site then with any of my hunting buddys. I want to reload and am in the prosess of setting up a 300RUM I got back in 2001. I ordered a NightForce scope and plan to take this rifle to MR. HART. in PA. for a tune-up. I have always sighted my guns at 1" high at 100yrd, and put deer down on the first shot. I have learned their is a hole lot more to shooting then just 1" hi. I am hungry to learn more. I have learned this takes time and a lot of money. These tricks seem easy when you have been doing them in the field for a long time. I am realy just getin out of the gategun)Please excuse my lack of knoledge, it will come to me in time. Bill Maylor.
You have nothiing to appoligize for, none of us were born knowing anything.
(18/3.7)*100 = 486 yards. Now, if I key it into LoadBase 2.0 or Exbal, they both say the answer is: 465 yards. That's 21 yards difference. No big deal we would say, the thing is that at 700 yards the accumulated error is big enough to miss the whole deer.
Let's say 18" target size with a reading of 2.4 MOA... (18/2.4)*100=750 yards. But LoadBase says is = to 716 yards. Difference is only 34 yards... My 300 RUM 210 gr. Beger would shoot 13.8 inches higher if I adjust for 750 and it's only 716 yards. If you're lucky you just miss the whole deer.
What is the problem then? Let's convert the size of the target 18" into moa. 18/1.047 = 17.19198. Now let's do the whole math again:
17.19198/2.4)*100=716.3 yards. That's much better. NOW YOU CAN SHOOT!
Many people don't believe that the 1.0472" (MOA) matters VS 1", but it does the small details makes all the difference between a hit or a miss.
.0472" matters for sure and for certain.
Now thats coollight bulb. Where can I find these kind of math? That is a hugh differance. Idont understand, or how they came up with minute as a math turm? Can someone rec. a book or mag that can explain these terms in use? Thanks Bill Maylor.