Michigan straight wall cartridge

[MSU Marksman]

careful with the 1885 in 454. Wild West guns here in anchorage did some testing and found that even after very few rounds the high pressure 454 caused dimesion changes to the receiver of the 1885. those old lever guns are nice but were never designed for a handgun cartridge as powerful as the 454. they actually made one of there own lever actions around the 500SW and the first one they tried was supposed to be strong enough. that first high pressure 500 split the action open like it was made of clay. so if you want longevity, maybe keep the 1885 to 45LC instead.

The 1885 is the falling block single shot. I'm sure it could handle the pressures.

That said, I know that lever actions have had some problems. It looks like Rossi is making a Model 92 in 454.

 

[SidecarFlip]

The Henry in 44 Remington Magnum, one has to be careful about how much propellant you use. I found out that a full house load in previously fired brass causes split cases.

 

[J E Custom]

Here you go:

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/hunting_and_trapping_digest_461177_7.pdf

Pages 11 and 17; page 17 has the specifics.

"Certain rifles capable of using .35 caliber or larger ammunition, with a straight-walled cartridge that has a minimum case length of 1.16 and a maximum case length of 1.80 inches and a .35 caliber or larger air rifle or pistol charged only from an external high compression power source (external hand pump, air tank, or air compressor), may be used in the Limited Firearm Deer Zone when taking deer."

The 450 bushmaster case is 1.700 to 1.710 well within the max length.

The choice of rifles is up to the user.

I love the old single shots, but for practical purposes a repeater (Bolt, leaver action, or semi auto) has some advantages for shots under 300 yards.

J E CUSTOM

 

[86alaskan]

ah sorry, i feel like an idiot... you're right its the '92 rossi that they said couldn't handle the pressures.

 

[J E Custom]

So it appears the 450 Bushmaster is a viable option? I might have to order a barrel for my spare Savage action I have laying around.

Previously I was keeping an eye out for a 1885 in 45LC or 454 Casual. I think a bolt action might be a better fit.

The 1885's High walls are very strong and can handle any load you want. the newly manufactured ones with modern steels are designed for the High pressure cartridges. The 1885 low walls are for
smaller cartridges and should not be used for Magnums.

The 1885's are a little more difficult to re barrel than most bolt actions but are well worth the trouble.

The Ruger #1's are also strong enough if you like single shots.

Just more information

J E CUSTOM

 

[ENCORE]

I know I'm a year late in this post but..... the .450 Bushmaster round has a new custom bolt action being made for it by Ultimate Firearms Inc. from Okemos, MI.
Muzzleloader - Long Range Muzzleloader - Custom Muzzleloader: Ultimate Firearms



I have one and what a shooter! Fit and finish is perfect, it functions perfect and is extremely accurate to 300yds, which is the furthest I've shot it to date.

I had a solid 1", 300yd group with my first three shots. I messed up the 4th shot and the 5th shot I held at the bottom of the Caldwell dot.



Shot it on my home range, where I can only shoot 150yds in the back yard.

 

[WildRose]

.35 whelen is out, it's not a straight wall cartridge and the case length is far too long.

I look at the ultimate muzzleloader, which is now being marketed by Remington. Seems to have a 200 fps advantage over .450 bushmaster with the same bullet. Which makes me wonder if the ml is making that velocity with a 26 inch barrel and the bushmaster out of a 20 inch, could I build an AR with a 24 inch barrel and produce similar velocity?

The AR platform appeals to me due to ease of carrying in the woods, modular ability, and reduced recoil. The semi-auto is nice, but a rather moot point in long range deer hunting.

I have long been a Remington fan, but I have not been impressed with their recent build quality and am hesitant to spend $1,300 on a first run muzzleloader.

Before venturing too far down this road I'd make double for sure that an AR platform rifle is legal for deer hunting in MI and in that specific zone.

There are more stupid gun laws than even stupid game laws.

All this new reg sounds like it would be good for is to increase the number of wounded animals that wonder off into the woods to die.

 

[WildRose]

I know I'm a year late in this post but..... the .450 Bushmaster round has a new custom bolt action being made for it by Ultimate Firearms Inc. from Okemos, MI.
Muzzleloader - Long Range Muzzleloader - Custom Muzzleloader: Ultimate Firearms



I have one and what a shooter! Fit and finish is perfect, it functions perfect and is extremely accurate to 300yds, which is the furthest I've shot it to date.

I had a solid 1", 300yd group with my first three shots. I messed up the 4th shot and the 5th shot I held at the bottom of the Caldwell dot.



Shot it on my home range, where I can only shoot 150yds in the back yard.

Nice.

 

[TXAoudadKlr]

I'd give the 45Raptor a look I think it will meet your needs but its intended for the LR/AR-10 platform if you wish to/go that route case length is 1.80 if not I'd go with the 450 bushmaster ideally on the AR platform but I'm not sure what the gun laws are in Michigan.

 

[ENCORE]

I'd give the 45Raptor a look I think it will meet your needs but its intended for the LR/AR-10 platform if you wish to/go that route case length is 1.80 if not I'd go with the 450 bushmaster ideally on the AR platform but I'm not sure what the gun laws are in Michigan.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/hunting_and_trapping_digest_461177_7.pdf#page=16

 

[TXAoudadKlr]

Not sure how to interpret that. Says unlawful to use semi auto that can hold more than 6 rounds. So would it be ok to use a 5 round magazine in an ar?

 

[engineer40]

That 45 Raptor is on my shortlist of rifles to get. I also live in Michigan. That Ultimate Firearms mentioned previously also makes a bolt gun in what they call a 460 S&W Mag Improved. It is actually a 45 Raptor. I think there were some legalities with using the 45 Raptor name (I'm assuming).

The 45 Raptor uses a standard 308 bolt face so it would be SUPER easy to convert many bolt actions we already own just by changing the barrel.

PT&G sells reamers. Although I did find a couple places that already sold barrels reamed for the 45 Raptor.

The 450 Bushmaster is a nice round. Just for everyone's info, this is the difference between the 450 Bushmaster and the 45 Raptor:
450 Bushmaster = Around 2,700ft lbs of energy at the muzzle.
45 Raptor = Around 3,700ft lbs of energy at the muzzle.

If a person wanted to go with a semi-auto platform, DPMS makes their AR10 G2 that can be configured in the 7lb range. Which is quite a bit less weight than many other AR10's.

The 45 Raptor uses the reloading dies and data from a 460 S&W Magnum and then just use a 308 shell plate.

I've looked into this extensively. I do believe the 45 Raptor is the most powerful, longest distance cartridge we can shoot at deer here in Michigan. That is if you want a repeater style firearm (because it does not have a rim).

If you are cool with a single shot, Thompson Center makes single shot 460S&W Mag's also that shares performance numbers with the 45 Raptor.

Hope this helps!

 

[ENCORE]

Not sure how to interpret that. Says unlawful to use semi auto that can hold more than 6 rounds. So would it be ok to use a 5 round magazine in an ar?

Yes.

 

[Kiwi Greg]

That 45 Raptor is on my shortlist of rifles to get. I also live in Michigan. That Ultimate Firearms mentioned previously also makes a bolt gun in what they call a 460 S&W Mag Improved. It is actually a 45 Raptor. I think there were some legalities with using the 45 Raptor name (I'm assuming).

The 45 Raptor uses a standard 308 bolt face so it would be SUPER easy to convert many bolt actions we already own just by changing the barrel.

PT&G sells reamers. Although I did find a couple places that already sold barrels reamed for the 45 Raptor.

The 450 Bushmaster is a nice round. Just for everyone's info, this is the difference between the 450 Bushmaster and the 45 Raptor:
450 Bushmaster = Around 2,700ft lbs of energy at the muzzle.
45 Raptor = Around 3,700ft lbs of energy at the muzzle.

If a person wanted to go with a semi-auto platform, DPMS makes their AR10 G2 that can be configured in the 7lb range. Which is quite a bit less weight than many other AR10's.

The 45 Raptor uses the reloading dies and data from a 460 S&W Magnum and then just use a 308 shell plate.

I've looked into this extensively. I do believe the 45 Raptor is the most powerful, longest distance cartridge we can shoot at deer here in Michigan. That is if you want a repeater style firearm (because it does not have a rim).

If you are cool with a single shot, Thompson Center makes single shot 460S&W Mag's also that shares performance numbers with the 45 Raptor.

Hope this helps!

Just to clarify the 450 Bushmaster factory loads are reasonably low pressure to work in a AR15 platform.

If you hand load for a bolt action you can easily get more velocity.

My 12" barrelled bolt actions could easily achieve 23-2350 fps with hand loads using the 250 FTX.

Judging by the size of the flame out of the muzzle if you had a 20-22" barrelled bolt action I'm sure the velocity would be much greater.

Even though the 450 BM is shorter than the 45 Raptor as it is modelled on the 284 case with its rebated rim it possibly has as much or more internal capacity as the Raptor.

It too uses the standard 308 bolt face & will work in the Ex 308 family Bolt actions that I have used, Rem 700, Kimber & T3 Tikka.

Magazine feeding is better with the FTX type projectiles rather than the big flat nose pistol ones.

I must build a 450 Bolt Action with a decent length barrel one day