match bullets on game

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by jmcs, Aug 1, 2007.

  1. jmcs

    jmcs Member

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    Does anybody out there have experience hunting at medium ranges with Sierra .270 135 gr HPBT for hunting?
     
  2. Eric Stecker

    Eric Stecker <b>SPONSOR</b>

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    Experience with Berger

    jmcs,

    The title of your thread compels me to respond. I of course can't help you with the SMK however our Berger Match VLD have been very successful on big game. I'll gladly send a free 30 minute DVD showing what our Match VLD does when used for hunting. Send an email listing your interest in the DVD and your shipping address to andrea.cobos@bergerbullets.com. For more on this we were recently written up in the August 2007 issue of Handloader.

    We do not have a 270 cal bullet right now but will have three different weights made in the next few months.

    Regards,
    Eric Stecker
    Berger Bullets
     

  3. magicofmt

    magicofmt Well-Known Member

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    Great News

    What weights will the 3 new 270 cal bullets be? Looking for 180 gr.

    Thanks!
     
  4. Fergus Bailey

    Fergus Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Eric

    Great to see you on this forum. Your DVD is a good source of info, as in the Barsness article.

    With regard to the 270 bullets, the sooner the better as far as I am concerned. What weights will these be offered in?
     
  5. jmcs

    jmcs Member

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    Eric,
    Thanks for the offer - I have emailed Andrea and look forward to the DVD. I am also keen to know what weights your .270 bullets will come in. It is a very popular cal. in South Africa. I shoot everything non dangerous with mine. It is a Savage 110 action on an Anschutz barrel - wonderful weapon.
    Thanks
    Dave
     
  6. LRHWAL

    LRHWAL Well-Known Member

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    JCMS, no experience in .277, but quite a few of us in .308 Win and .300 UM and 7mm (Rem Mag and .280 Rem) and Bergers in .300 WM.

    Good results all round, but weight was 168gr up to 220gr.

    I've even used A-Max on smaller game in my .300 WM - Blesbuck and Springbuck, with great results.

    As you know, not everyone feels the same about it.

    I was required to shoot an Eland wounded by another in our party earlier this year at around 15 yards I think it was, with a 210gr Berger (MV 2830 or so). Right on the shoulder - he was dead in seconds. Do I recommend a Berger for something as heavily boned in the forequarters as Eland? No, but it did what was required (that time). I can't tell you how large a pice of bullet (or if all of it) made it to the vitals.

    At medium / longer ranges risk of breakup reduces, but hitting heavy shoulder bones remain a risk I'd think. It depends a lot on what you are hunting.

    WL
     
  7. Eric Stecker

    Eric Stecker <b>SPONSOR</b>

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    The first 270 cal bullets will be 130 gr, 140 gr and 150 gr. We will likely make lighter and heavier bullets in 270 cal but they will be down the road (a year or more). We have several new bullets coming out over the next twelve months so it will be a while before we can revisit the 270 again.

    Regarding close up shots at high MV, we traveled to West Virginia to hunt wild pigs with Richard Mann. Richard is the developer of the Bullet Test TUBE and has tested just about every bullet made. Before we started hunting Richard believed that our bullet would act like any cup and core bullet producing rapid expansion. It has been Richards findings that every bullet (including high weight retaining bullets) start their expansion upon impact.

    We shot 5 large wild hogs on that trip. The shots were taken from 20 feet to about 75 yards. Four of the hogs dropped where they were shot. One hog that I shot after it had been spooked ran about 50 feet. We found during the autopsy that this hog had a hole in its heart I could easily slide two fingers into. How it managed to run after the massive amount of internal damage to the vitals surprised everyone. The guides said that they have never seen 5 hogs drop like those that we shot.

    To test the VLD further, we set one of the larger hogs up so that we could shoot it right through the shoulder and hip bones. Both shots were taken from 10 inches away and were shot with a 6.5mm 140 gr VLD (it was the highest velocity load we had at the time at just about 3,100 fps). Both shots penetrated through each bone and created wound channels that were 15" and 18" deep. The amount of internal tissue damage was tremendous. (For those of you who have shot a hog in the rear hip area you know how much fun we had doing that particular autopsy)

    I certainly don't recommend shooting them in the hip. We wanted to see if the bullet would blow up on the surface and it did not. During this trip we fired shots into the Bullet Test TUBE that Richard brought with him. We found that the VLD is the only bullet that penetrates 1" to 1.5" in the Test TUBE (In animals typical penetration is 2" to 3"). This is a result that Richard did not expect and was the key proof he needed to understand that the Berger Match VLD is in fact usable and very successful for game.

    Regards,
    Eric
     
  8. Ernie

    Ernie SPONSOR

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    Eric,
    Thank you for all the info and welcome to the forum.
    I have not used your VLD for game yet, but have used SMK's, A-Max's and Richard's Wildcat bullets with success. I have a 7mm Rem Mag Imp in a rear grip MOA Maximum specialty pistol that likes your 180 grainers and hope to use it this year.

    Any advice for the 140 grain in the 6.5 as regards to minimum impact velocity? Same question for the 7mm 180 grain.
     
  9. Buffalobob

    Buffalobob Writers Guild

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    Eric

    This is a part of a story I posted back in May about the 6mm 115 Berger and the 240 Wby. The bullet penetrates like crazy and blows big holes as it goes through.

     
  10. bailey1474

    bailey1474 <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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    I don't know the extent of your testing, but you might want to consider doing some lower velocity tests. I had a bad experience w/the 105 gr 6mm VLD on a whitetail doe this past fall. Here's the link:

    http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19433

    I think the bullets effectiveness may not be limited by too much velocity but too little.

    I'm not bashing your bullets. Just stating my experience on game. I have shot some phenominal groups w/this bullet but I don't think the 6-250 enough pumpkin to open that bullet up @ longer ranges.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2007
  11. steve smith

    steve smith Well-Known Member

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    The answer to your question is yes!

    I've use the .277" 135 Mk on many deer over the past 10years. Ranges from 100-850yds. None have ever failed. (ie. dead deer).

    They are accurate and kill deer very good!
     
  12. davewilson

    davewilson Well-Known Member

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    i've seen 2 examples where the sierra failed on game.both shots were under 100 yards. both blew up with no/very little penetration.i used to hang out in Saskatchewan and spend 5 weeks hunting deer.it was with an outfitter so you got to see a little bit of everything.first was a mule deer that wasn't supposed to be shot, but he nailed him right on the shoulder blade. i know this because 3 hours and 2 miles later we were looking at each other as he laid under a spruce tree and my boss stuck him with his yellow handled knife as he tried to get away.a couple small pieces of whatever went inside the ribs but most of the bullet blew up on the outside.

    the second example was an impact on the middle of the backbone,as the deer( a 170 whitetail) was quartering away. bullet hit the backstrap about the bottom of the backbone and never even broke it's back. made about a tennis ball sized hole in the strap, but again, never even went through the backbone. just pieces of jacket all over. after seeing these 2 examples it was hard for me to put trust in match bullets for game.

    both examples were shot with a 270 and were under 100 yards. to be honest, i'll never own a 270. not saying there's anything wrong with it, but the bad taste will always be there.

    my personal opinion is not to use match bullets smaller than 30 caliber for big game and always the heavy per caliber bullets.
     
  13. specweldtom

    specweldtom Well-Known Member

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    The info on the Bergers is great. I like their bullets in .223 and 7mm, but haven't hunted with them. In 1985, I started hunting with Sierra MKHP, but only in .30 cal. Have only killed whitetails with them, but have absolute confidence in them. Have used .300 WM, .300 H & H, and .30 x .378, all with 190 gr MKHP's, and all lung shots. Some were knocked down and stayed down, some ran 20 feet - 20 yards. Don't know if they went down and got up or not; enough recoil and muzzle flash that I don't see the hit or the immediate aftermath. Longest shot was 280 yds, shortest was 100 yds on a hard-running buck. My brother saw that hit and said he was in mid-air, and looked like he was hit by a freight train.

    Nearly every page in the Sierra manual says that MK's are not recommended for hunting. I wouldn't hunt thick skinned or heavy boned game with them (except for hogs), but I suspect that my 300 gr MKHP .338 x .378 load could handle Black bear or even Elk very well.

    Last time I checked, Berger wasn't making anything bigger than .30 cal.

    Good thread, Tom
     
  14. davewilson

    davewilson Well-Known Member

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    Spec, keep watching that Berger web site. those 338 bullets are coming, end of this year or early next! many are anxiously waiting.