Long range budget build

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by Loud by design, Oct 11, 2012.

  1. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    Hi everyone, I am new to the forum and have enjoyed reading around on it for the past few months and now have decided to join. I have been shooting long range for me but short range for many of you (around 400 yds) for a while now with my 30-06 and now am looking to move my rang out to 600-800 yds. To do this I am looking to build another rifle that is relatively cheap to shoot and not a high end or custom rifle as I just don't have the funds for it. My 3 highest condensers I am looking at are in this order the savage 12bvss, Remington 700 sps, and howa heavy barreled 1500s all in .223 Remington. The savage is my top contender but is also the most expensive rifle on the list. The Remington is the cheapest as the local walmart caries them for 440-460 and Remington is offering a 40 dollar rebate bringing the price down to 400-420 for the rifle as it sits. Add in another 100 for a boyds stock and it will be right around 500-520. The howa fits in the middle and I have always heard geat things about them but never had any experience with them. Total budget for the rifle scope and any othe accessories has got to stay under or close to 1000. Also the reason for picking the .223/5.56 round is again because it is cheap and will allow me to shoot more often and longer without breaking the bank. Any suggestions? Thanks.
     
  2. snox801

    snox801 Well-Known Member

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    I have several savage rides all shoot great. I done think you could Do wrong. that being said I won my first howa1500 at safari club. It is a 204, but it is quickly becoming my favorite gun. This thing is super accurate can cover a five shot group with a quarter @100. I would put my vote for the howa. But you would also be very happy with the savage. In fact I have a friend that shoots a stock savage axis ad it also shoots great may just be luck of the draw.
     

  3. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    well i took a stroll around today and after walking around a few gunshops, the local basspro, and dicks sporting goods it think i might have ended my search.i found a remington 700 sps varminter in camo with the heavy barrel on sale with a few rebates and coupons. after all the rebates and the sale they are putting on the rifle will ring up at $380. i compared it to the savage base model 12 they had at bass pro which was 630 and the remington fit me better. also i think the stock on the remington was a good bit stifferand didnt feel quite as mushy as the savage. if the cost difference wasnt so substantial between the model 12bvss which they said they could order for 895 id probably have sprung for it but im thinking that a good bit of work could be done to the remington for the 515 extra ill have left over if need be. verdict is i should have a new remington 700 in my hands tomorrow if all goes well unless someone on here has a reason not to pick it up. if anyone has any experience on this rifle that would be great. thanks everyone once again.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2012
  4. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    Actually the 30/06 is a great 1000 yard rifle with the right load and bullet combo. The 30/06 held
    all of the major LR records at one time and with new bullets and powder available they are even
    better today.

    The 223 is one of the most fun rifles I have but the wind is its #1 enemy at anything over 300 yards
    unless you are a master at reading it.

    Conditions have to be very good to be accurate at greater distances with any .224 caliber cartrige
    so I would recomend a larger diameter bullet for true Long range Hunting. A 6.5 would be about
    my lower limit and .338 the upper limit for reasonable cost and performance.

    I am not trying to talk you out of the 223 but just make you aware that it has it's shortcomings
    at extended ranges.

    Just something to think about.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  5. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    Ballistically the 30-06 is a much superior load compared to the 223 for what I'm trying to do. My issue with it is it's to expensive to shoot as much as I want/need to to really improve my skill. The 223 will be a range riffle 98% of the time unless a coyote or something else fairly small needs to be taken care of. Also as you had said the wind will affect the 223 more, I do realize that but here's my idea, at first it will be a bit harder to shoot accurately but I'm thinking that I will just have to learn to read the wind better so in the long run it will make me a better hunter/shooter. Hopefully
     
  6. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    well i brought the rifle out to the range yesterday and in its bone stock configuration without the barrel being broken in and using the cheap remington scope that came on top of it, less than 1" 5 shot groups were the norm. now i know many people will see 1" and say well thats okay but not great but considering the ammo (remington umc 55 grain), the scope, and the shooter especially i feel that with minimal work( new scope) this rifle could be a very very accurate platform. also i am unsure if it was the barrel warming up or me pulling the rifle slightly as i squezed the trigger but i would get 4 shots touching and then one to the right by maybe 1/4 inch. sometimes less and sometimes more. as of now i am going to chalk it up to me pulling the rifle, just wanted to know what all of you thought it might be
     
  7. golffitron

    golffitron New Member

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    I would suspect your choice in ammo, off the shelf ammo could be inconsistant. I really see a difference in ammo with my 7 mm. I can get hand loads to cover a dime at 200 and can't seem to cover a quarter at the same distance with off the shelf loads. Just a thought.
     
  8. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    I am going to eventually start reloading it's just everytime I get the money to buy my press and powder ect. I find a great deal on something else like the vortex viper I'm going to put on this rifle. I am slowly putting together a reloading setup bits and pieces at a time. Plus with this cheap ammo I can shoot it and still keep the brass.
     
  9. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    There is no question that the 223 should help ones shooting because of the amount of ammo
    and the price of available ammo.

    I noticed that you intend to start reloading. this will make the larger caliber rounds very reasonable
    and the cost will not be much more than reloading the 223.

    I had the urge to own a 223, and the fact that I reload I decided to build a 223 AI that would shoot
    factory ammo accurately while fire forming and when loaded to 223 AI specs. It would gain 150 to
    200 ft/sec more with the heaver bullets.

    The 223 AI has done everything better than I expected and accuracy is outstanding during the
    fire form stage, and with good reloads it is a consistant 1/4 MOA rifle.

    Just something to think about if you are going to start reloading.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  10. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    I thought about going the ai route but the only problem is I am no expert in reloading and also I don't know of any competent gunsmiths in the area. Plus I was worried about forming the cases for it. Witht the .223 I should be looking at right around 27 cents a round using hornady 53 gr Amax I believe where as reloading for my 338 win mag will be right around 58 cents per round. At that point there's not nearly as huge of a price difference as buying factory ammo but it's still roughly twice the cost. Also the 223 has the added benefit of 1/10th the recoil. The ai has intrigued me though and is not entirely out of the question
     
  11. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    The reason I mentioned it was that you said you were getting into reloading,and it sounded
    like you realy wanted to stay with the 223.

    The 223 is the round that I recomend for shooting at the range because of the cost of factory
    ammo.

    If the chamber is cut correctly, factory ammo can be used for hunting and the brass can be
    fire formed at the same time for loading the AI.

    I build a lot of 280 AI Remington's for hunters and a match rifle for F class with the same
    chamber so the guys can hunt with a hunting weight rifle with factory ammo and load the
    fire formed brass for the match rifle.

    The AI version is very close to a 7mmRM in performance and the plane version 280 rem
    is a great hunting round.

    The 223 and the 223 AI have about the same relationship.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  12. Cold Trigger Finger

    Cold Trigger Finger Well-Known Member

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    How does your model 700 feed. I had a VTR in 223 that jammed 1 in 4 or 5 times
    I wasn't happy with the X mark trigger. But I liked the rifle. Hated the jamming.
     
  13. Loud by design

    Loud by design Active Member

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    I've put 240 rounds down the tube now and not a single jam. I have heard of people having the same problem as you though. You may have already tried but I always make sure I push the rounds all the way to the rear of the magazine. Also some people have said to stretch the magazine spring one way or another may help to keep the rounds straighter in the magazine instead of being crooked and binding. Another is that some people said the tension on the rear of the receiver can have something to do with it. Only other thing I could think to try would be some good dry lube because that really helped me out on my sks.

    As far as the trigger mines set right at 3 lbs from the factory. I would like to adjust it down a little if I could but I don't have a torque wrench in inch lbs and don't want to pull the rifle out of the stock without one. Also mine is the X mark not X mark pro so it doesn't have the Allen key on the trigger itself. No creep and it's pretty smooth. The only rifle with a better trigger I have shot has been on my uncles rifle which I believe was a huber trigger set real light. Though my experience (besides his rifle) is pretty limited to other factory rifles like my browning bars and and a few savage rifles without the accutrigger.
     
  14. Cold Trigger Finger

    Cold Trigger Finger Well-Known Member

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    Good deal. I like Remington rifles but, I like Rugers and CZs better. If Rem. Would make the VTR in 260 I would get one. I like the odd triangle barrel and cut muzzle brake ..
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2012