Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by chillippr, Aug 30, 2005.

  1. chillippr

    chillippr Member

    Jan 14, 2005
    With hundreds of thousands of illegals flooding into this country, the law enforcement leadership is concentrating on harassing law abiding gun owners!

    From today's VCDL VA-ALERT. For those of you not in VA, you can still follow the instructions below, as it will work with all 50 states:

    In the NRA's Cam Edward's interview of the reporter, a new allegation came out: the BATFE had planted hidden cameras at the last few Richmond gun shows and lied to the building owners saying that the BATFE had permission to do so from the gun shown owner, Annette Gelles!

    Smile, you're on candid camera. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

    Trouble is that it was illegal since things like filming are controlled by gun show management.

    Annette learned by accident, when a similar attempt in NoVA was brought to her attention by building management. In that case BATFE was sent packing.

    I am getting tired of shaking my head at the shameful actions of BATFE.

    Roy B. Scherer has been going after information from Richmond and the VA State Police.

    Richmond Police officer Major McCoy acknowledged Richmond having 8 officers at the show, but didn't mention the patrol officers who were dispatched to people's houses.

    VASP representative Corrine Geller acknowledged the task force, but said that the State Police did not go knocking on doors.

    We still haven't heard from Henrico, who also had their hands in this mess.

    Member Hank Moody asked that I share information to those who might like to help Annette cover her legal fees in the fight against BATFE. If you are so inclined, here is her contact info:

    Annette Gelles
    P.O. Box 10277,
    Blacksburg VA 24062

    Many of you have already contacted Senators Allen and Warner and your local representative. Member Mike Wright said that Virgil Goode's office is investigating.


    We need to contact Senator Allen, Senator Warner, and your local Congressman.

    Simply go to the VCDL web page:

    And at the bottom of the right-most column and in the section labeled 'Write to Congress,' type in your ZIP code and click "GO"

    You will then be at the NRA email system for the Federal Government with contact info for Senators Allen and Warner and your Representative.

    Suggested email/message:

    Dear [Senator/Representative],

    At a Richmond gun show in on August 13th and 14th the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE) stepped way over the line by actually sharing National Instant Check System (NICS) information with local police, who then dispatched officers to the houses of people who were in the act of purchasing guns at the show! Family members were asked questions like, "Did you know your husband was buying a gun today?" "How many guns does your husband have?"

    Worse, if no one was at home, neighbors were contacted about the purchase!

    Other law-abiding citizens who attended the show were harassed by the BATFE and then let go since those citizens had done nothing wrong.

    The police presence at the show was so overwhelming as to be intimidating to both lawful customers and dealers.

    More information on these BATFE abuses can be found in the article that first broke the story:

    I urge you to demand an explanation from BATFE about this operation and have a Congressional hearing on the matter since it appears that Federal privacy and gun laws were broken.

    We are a nation of laws in which the ends does not necessarily justify the means. The rights and freedoms of the good people of this Country are sacred. Perhaps the time has come to ask if the 'F' in 'BATFE" should be removed.

    Please let me know what you are going to do about this abuse of power by the BATFE.

  2. 257speed

    257speed Well-Known Member

    Mar 29, 2004
    Chilippr, I can understand your frustration, but be careful with your "blanket" accusation attacking "Law Enforcement". There are a number of Law Enforcement people on this site, who I am sure are offended by your accusations. The BATF is FAR from the officers that patrol the streets of America, so in the future please watch your words and be less offensive. It really takes away from the heart of what you are trying to say, which has merit in itself.

  3. Shawn Carlock

    Shawn Carlock Sponsor

    Jun 11, 2007
    I would have to agree with 257speed, having spend a great deal of time in law enforcement and getting to know several of the BATF enforcement officers in the Northwest I can tell you most are very pro gun. Now I will admit that the futher east you get there seems to be more people within law enforcement in general that are not as pro gun but it has been my experience that law enforcement in general in the US is very pro gun and pro " defend yourself when you need to".
  4. chillippr

    chillippr Member

    Jan 14, 2005
    Sorry for any offense. Please note that I refered specifically to "law enforcement leadership" and many of them do not support gun ownership. IMHO
  5. 257speed

    257speed Well-Known Member

    Mar 29, 2004
    As Shawn said, I think you will also find a huge difference in the Law Enforcement attitude of the Northeastern agencies as compared to the southeast or Western attitudes. As with just about anything else, the guys on the street doing the work have a very different outlook on things than the men who are in charge and not doing the job anymore. We are fortunate here in New Mexico, the ATF guys here are set on taking guns from criminals and we don't have the horror stories that you hear about other places.
  6. p dog shooter

    p dog shooter Well-Known Member

    May 8, 2001
    I ve been in law enforcement going on 28 years. I have seen a big change in Street level pro gun guys. 20 plus years ago most officers were gun guys and pro gun.

    A lot of officers hired in the last years never held a gun before being hired, A lot belive the old domimit liberial media lies about guns and gun control. One female deputy up here said she would gladly disobey the consitution when it comes to guns as they were not good anyway.

    No there are very pro gun law enforcement officers but also there are a lot that well follow orders when it comes time to break in your doors to get your guns.

    A lot have brought into the thought that a law is vaild until the courts rule on it my reply is if a law in plainly unconsitutionl it is illegal to enforce on it face. Almost every officer takes a oath of office to up hold the US consitution frist the state consitution 2nd and the laws lastly.

    A lot have gotten it back wards. Enforce the law no matter what let the courts sort it out.

    When we see actions like in VA.It makes one wonder who's ones freinds are.
  7. sniper2

    sniper2 Well-Known Member

    Jan 10, 2003
    These people are individuals having made this statement,I have shot with some local Law enforcement agents that are very pro gun...