JLK VLDs?

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by MontanaRifleman, May 1, 2009.

  1. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Are any of you guys using these bullets?

    I am looking into developing some loads for a 300 RUM and 7mm RM and was thinking about using the 210 and 180 VLDs. Their asvertised BC is quite high, so I was wondering if they are close to accurate down range.

    The Berger's 30 cal 210 VLD shows .616 vs the JLK's .665 or 680 (LBT)

    The Berger 7mm 180 shows .659 to the JLK .735.

    I know that Berger recently lowered their advertised BC's in an effort to give a more accurate performance. Do the JLK's measure up to their advetised BC's?

    Thanks,

    MR
     
  2. bwaites

    bwaites Well-Known Member

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    I am still working on a comparison in my WSM 7mm, but at ranges out to 700 yards and using the same loads on reactive targets, there was minimal difference.

    I'm continuing to work them up, but using the 7 inch reactive targets, I used the same drops and wind data for both, and blew up the targets.

    Now, 7 inches is 1 MOA at 700 yards, and that certainly isn't tight enough for competition, thus, at least in my mind, the jury is still out, but I think the two are closer than the stated BC's would appear.

    Bill
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2009

  3. jmason

    jmason Well-Known Member

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    Bill and MR- please keep us posted. I have a 7mm wsm being throated for the Berger 180VLDs. I'd like to cheat from you guys and cut the curve a bit too.:D
     
  4. BountyHunter

    BountyHunter Writers Guild

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    As far as accuracy goes with the JLKs, no need to worry. I have won a lot of matches with them.

    BH
     
  5. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Bill, When crunching the numbers I find the the difference in drop to be about 3" @ 700 yds with the advertized BCs. The JLK (with advrtized BC) will get about 100 yds farther down range than the Berger @ 1800 fps.

    Keep us posted,

    MR
     
  6. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Thanks BH, nice to know they shoot well.
     
  7. BryanLitz

    BryanLitz <b>Official LRH Sponsor</b>

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    Jmason (and others)
    Regarding the JLK BC's, I haven't tested the .30 cals, so I won't comment on those, but I have tested the 7mm 180 VLD's from both Berger and JLK. There's a short write up in 6mmbr.com's articles archive. I can't get a link directly to the article, but if you go here:

    AccurateShooter.com Daily Bulletin

    And type JLK into the search box on the right, it will bring up the analysis including dimensioned drawings of both the Berger and JLK.

    Bottom line is the bullets (JLK and Berger VLD's) which are the same caliber, weight, and shape, not surprisingly have very similar BC's.

    -Bryan
     
  8. bwaites

    bwaites Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure that there is any real world difference in the BC's, and Bryan points out that the group of JLK's he tested had a slightly larger Meplat than the Bergers he tested. The meplat on the JLK's I have are also ever so slightly larger than the Bergers I have. (It's minimal, but enough that I can tell them apart when 5 are loaded and placed beside 5 loaded Bergers.)

    I don't have a pointing tool, (guess that goes on the next order from whereever!). I suspect that if the Meplats were the same, your couldn't tell them apart.

    JLK runs their bullets in batches, as does Berger, so it would be nice if they could get on opposite schedules so we would have one or the other all the time!!

    I think they both are premium bullets with great long range effectiveness for paper punching.

    I haven't heard of anyone hunting with the JLK's, and I don't hunt anything but coyotes, so I'm not a good one to comment on that aspect.

    Bill
     
  9. dbhostler

    dbhostler Well-Known Member

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    Have shot JLKs for years in 30 cal, 190s in 3006 and 210s in 300 um. The bullets were different when Jimmy Knox made them, but the new ones are ok too. There are other custom makers that make good bullets too. You might try some Knight, Clinch River or BIBs.
    db
     
  10. BountyHunter

    BountyHunter Writers Guild

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    BIBs are great bullets, however they are a long long FB bullet that needs special throating for the bullet base to seat in the neck. Randy Robinett just announced a new short BT 108 gr 6mm that should work. It is simple for the smith to use a hand reamer from PTG to lengthen the throat.

    Clinch River- Greg Seigmund is hard to get in touch with now and as he has a fulltime job last I knew he was not taking on any new customers. Great bullets IF you can get on his list.

    Swampy who now has JLK, is using the same dies that Jimmy used except for the standard 210 JLK, but from same die maker. So they are super close to the original die as possible.

    BH
     
  11. Kevin

    Kevin Well-Known Member

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    I have shot two deer with the .30cal 190 JLK's. Both deer were 650 yards and the bullets passed though leaving 1-2inch exit holes. I also shot a deer at 650 with the 190 SMK and it may have made a slightly bigger exit hole, but not by much. I found the advertised BC to line up pretty close to real world results.
     
  12. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all the input guys. I do plan on trying some other bullets also but was just wondering how the JLK advertized BC stacked up.

    Thanks again,

    Mark
     
  13. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for dropping in Byan, and a good article too. It did seem strange to me that 2 bullets that were so close in design shoud have that much difference in BC, which is why I asked the question. Maybe one is consrvative or the other liberal with their estimation :)

    Question for you... How well would shooting through 2 chronies work for getting an accurate BC? Say one at muzzle and another at 300 yds?
     
  14. BryanLitz

    BryanLitz <b>Official LRH Sponsor</b>

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    In theory this can go very good, in practice, it can go very bad!

    The first step would be to set the chrony's up right against each other and shoot thru them to insure they're both reading the same velocity (or the expected 2-3 fps difference). This is key.
    Next, make sure you have the accuracy to thread the needle before you try shooting thru the chrono at 300 yards.
    Be sure you measure the atmospherics (air temperature, pressure and humidity).
    It's very important that you measure the exact distance between the chrony's; with as little uncertainty as possible (+/- 1 foot is pretty good).
    After you've collected the data, you can go to:
    JBM - Calculations - Ballistic Coefficient (Velocity)
    and plug it in. This will result in a very accurate BC that's corrected for standard atmospheric conditions. The BC will be the average value over 300 yards.
    If you're ambitious enough, you can set the downrange chronograph at 100, 200, and 300 yards to get an idea of how much the BC changes with velocity. Another way would be to load your ammo fast and slow and shoot the same distance. This will make it harder to thread the needle.

    Here's a link to an article I wrote about measuring BC's with the two chrno method. The article focuses on dispelling the worry that excessive pitching/yawing motion could affect the measured BC over short distance.

    I hope you decide to take this on and share your experiences. Please be careful with that downrange chrono!

    Take care,
    -Bryan