Its finally time!!!
- Thread starter Fiftydriver
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Fiftydriver
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Budman,
When I ordered my reamer specs, I did not want a "tight" necked rifle. That being said I did want an accurate snug neck.
I specified my reamer to have a neck diameter of 0.3690". My loaded ammo using the 300 gr Sierra Mk has a neck diameter of 0.3675" or roughly 0.0015" less then my chamber neck dimension which provides my preferred 0.00075" bullet release per side when fired.
With the lot of brass I am using now, there is no need to turn necks nor does the brass require this proceedure. If it did though, I would be able to turn 0.0005" of the neck and still have a good fitting neck.
My theory is that 90% of a chambers accuracy potential, given that everything is square and true to the axis of the bore, which it better be, is centered in the area when the leade starts and the throat ends.
I have my extreme accuracy reamers build to cut a throat tht is only 0.0002" over bullet diameter. In a big game rifle this is a little tight in my opinion, but perfect for an extreme range rifle that will have its ammo loaded with top quality comp. dies for run outs of under 0.001".
The last few batches of Sierra 300 gr Mk's I have measured were running 0.3383" to 0.3384" in diameter. For this reason, I ordered my reamer to cut a 0.3385" diameter throat. This is an area where tight is a good thing.
The throat on this rifle is not overly long, just a bit less then .300". This positions the full diameter base of the 300 gr Mk even with the bottom of the case, allowing maximum case capacity volume while still ensuring the total case neck is used to support the bullet.
So to answer your questions, no I do not need to turn my necks but have the option to true them up is needs be without creating excessive play in the neck area.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
this throating system has worked well for me with several different calibers.
When I ordered my reamer specs, I did not want a "tight" necked rifle. That being said I did want an accurate snug neck.
I specified my reamer to have a neck diameter of 0.3690". My loaded ammo using the 300 gr Sierra Mk has a neck diameter of 0.3675" or roughly 0.0015" less then my chamber neck dimension which provides my preferred 0.00075" bullet release per side when fired.
With the lot of brass I am using now, there is no need to turn necks nor does the brass require this proceedure. If it did though, I would be able to turn 0.0005" of the neck and still have a good fitting neck.
My theory is that 90% of a chambers accuracy potential, given that everything is square and true to the axis of the bore, which it better be, is centered in the area when the leade starts and the throat ends.
I have my extreme accuracy reamers build to cut a throat tht is only 0.0002" over bullet diameter. In a big game rifle this is a little tight in my opinion, but perfect for an extreme range rifle that will have its ammo loaded with top quality comp. dies for run outs of under 0.001".
The last few batches of Sierra 300 gr Mk's I have measured were running 0.3383" to 0.3384" in diameter. For this reason, I ordered my reamer to cut a 0.3385" diameter throat. This is an area where tight is a good thing.
The throat on this rifle is not overly long, just a bit less then .300". This positions the full diameter base of the 300 gr Mk even with the bottom of the case, allowing maximum case capacity volume while still ensuring the total case neck is used to support the bullet.
So to answer your questions, no I do not need to turn my necks but have the option to true them up is needs be without creating excessive play in the neck area.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
this throating system has worked well for me with several different calibers.
Randy in Va
Well-Known Member
Fiftydriver
I hope you don't mean your stock is as ugly as this one!
I hope you don't mean your stock is as ugly as this one!
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
Randy,
The pick did not come up on the post???
At least not on my screen.
Good Shooting!!!
50
The pick did not come up on the post???
At least not on my screen.
Good Shooting!!!
50
Hey Fifty Driver I relize your busy building a great Rifle .Hope you get out of it what you want and then some.Could I ask you to give me your opinon on my range trip with the 6x284. Found H4350 was kick *** great. Thanks looking forward to some pixs of your current project.
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
jb1000br,
Tried to e-mail you the pics of my 338 Kahn and got a "could not deliever" message.
Could you give me your e-mail again and I will try to send them again, maybe I got it wrong the first time.
TOok the big girl out to my 300 yard range today, still basically breaking the barrel in but it is polishing up nicely, like all Lilja barrels do.
I am now shooting 3 shot groups and cleaning between each group to get a little load developement done while I am breaking in the barrel.
The light was to low in the sky to use the chrono this morning but I am more interested in group size right now more then velocity, I will get real serious when the 300 and 350 gr ULD Wildcat bullets get here.
Anyway, shot four groups and here are the results:
Group 1, 103.0 gr H-50BMG
0.912" ctc
Group 2, 104.0 gr H-50BMG
1.006" ctc
Group 3, 105 gr H-50BMG
1.117" ctc
Group 4, 106 gr H-50BMG
1.010" ctc
The rifle is averaging 1/3 moa with ammo basically thrown together and the nice thing is that the first shot out of every group is the flier from the oily barrel.
The second two rounds of each group range from .421" ctc at the largest to .113" ctc for the tightest.
I am sure that without the cleaning between each group, the group size would average in the 1/4 moa range pretty easily.
Like I said, I have no velocity data yet but I can tell you these loads do not produce enough pressure to open the case mouths when firing so they are in the 45,000 to 50,000 psi range.
I just loaded up 107.0, 108.0, 109.0 and 110.0 gr with the 300 gr Sierra Mk and will test them tomorrow. I think I will get some chrono readings as well and I will set up at my 500 yard range to get a better idea of the load performance.
Will let you know how things go.
So far, I am happy with 1/3 moa at 300 yards but hope to trim that to an average of 1/4 moa at 500 yards in ideal conditions which this morning it certainly was not, about a 20 mph cross wind but did not produce any horizontal stringing.
Good Shooting!!
Kirby Allen(50)
[ 08-28-2004: Message edited by: Fiftydriver ]
Tried to e-mail you the pics of my 338 Kahn and got a "could not deliever" message.
Could you give me your e-mail again and I will try to send them again, maybe I got it wrong the first time.
TOok the big girl out to my 300 yard range today, still basically breaking the barrel in but it is polishing up nicely, like all Lilja barrels do.
I am now shooting 3 shot groups and cleaning between each group to get a little load developement done while I am breaking in the barrel.
The light was to low in the sky to use the chrono this morning but I am more interested in group size right now more then velocity, I will get real serious when the 300 and 350 gr ULD Wildcat bullets get here.
Anyway, shot four groups and here are the results:
Group 1, 103.0 gr H-50BMG
0.912" ctc
Group 2, 104.0 gr H-50BMG
1.006" ctc
Group 3, 105 gr H-50BMG
1.117" ctc
Group 4, 106 gr H-50BMG
1.010" ctc
The rifle is averaging 1/3 moa with ammo basically thrown together and the nice thing is that the first shot out of every group is the flier from the oily barrel.
The second two rounds of each group range from .421" ctc at the largest to .113" ctc for the tightest.
I am sure that without the cleaning between each group, the group size would average in the 1/4 moa range pretty easily.
Like I said, I have no velocity data yet but I can tell you these loads do not produce enough pressure to open the case mouths when firing so they are in the 45,000 to 50,000 psi range.
I just loaded up 107.0, 108.0, 109.0 and 110.0 gr with the 300 gr Sierra Mk and will test them tomorrow. I think I will get some chrono readings as well and I will set up at my 500 yard range to get a better idea of the load performance.
Will let you know how things go.
So far, I am happy with 1/3 moa at 300 yards but hope to trim that to an average of 1/4 moa at 500 yards in ideal conditions which this morning it certainly was not, about a 20 mph cross wind but did not produce any horizontal stringing.
Good Shooting!!
Kirby Allen(50)
[ 08-28-2004: Message edited by: Fiftydriver ]
LB
Well-Known Member
Interesting thread. Best of luck. I may send you some work, if you can give me an opinion of KP barrels? LB
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
LB,
I will be totally honest with you and say that I have never cut a KP barrel but I have heard quite a bit about them and have not heard anything negative.
If I were building a customer an extreme accruacy rifle I would first and foremost recommend a Lilja but there are others on the market that are very quality barrels as well so if the customer has a brand of barrel they want to use, I am more then willing to fit it up for them.
I fit and chamber them all the same no matter if its a $450 Lilja blank or a $80 A&B blank, to match specs.
I must tell you I do not have physical experience with the KP barrels.
If they are quality blanks, I will make you a fine shooting rifle with one.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
I will be totally honest with you and say that I have never cut a KP barrel but I have heard quite a bit about them and have not heard anything negative.
If I were building a customer an extreme accruacy rifle I would first and foremost recommend a Lilja but there are others on the market that are very quality barrels as well so if the customer has a brand of barrel they want to use, I am more then willing to fit it up for them.
I fit and chamber them all the same no matter if its a $450 Lilja blank or a $80 A&B blank, to match specs.
I must tell you I do not have physical experience with the KP barrels.
If they are quality blanks, I will make you a fine shooting rifle with one.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
The K-P barrels shoot extremely well.In 50bmg they hold every record there is to hold and Ken and Peggy Johnson thats the K-P are very active in the FCSA (fifty caliber shooters association)shoots.They are located in Raton,New Mexico and have built some outstanding barrels.Bob Crone of 1000 yard and F-Class world team fame is using them very sucessfully.The Lilja barrels shoot great but tend to wear out a little faster in my experience.The K-P turn-around time can be frustrating from time to time but they have excellent customer service if a problem is encountered.Dan on the other hand has super reliable estimates on when your barrel will ship but his customer skills when its his problem are dead last.I ordered up a 1.750 X 36 inch 30cal SS tube from him and it came marked 10 twist 1.750X36 SS Straight plus had my name on it.The barrel was 1.660 at its largest dimension then tapered to 1.580 the 320 grit finish looked like a spiral staircase and it cost me $420 Two calls to Dan and all i got was "well the bore is straight" not what i wanted to hear after buying a $400 barrel block for a 1.750 barrel.I'm sure after the message i left on his phone Dan will remember me.
Lynn
Lynn
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
Lynn,
Being a member of the FCSA is where I have heard all the good things about the K-P barrels.
Skip Talbot is a big supporter of these barrels and if you know anything about this fine fellow, you know these barrels must shoot.
I am sorry to hear about your problems with Dan Lilja. I have ordered and fitted dozens of his barrels without a single problem ever.
Still his shop is still run by human power so there is always the possibility of error.
Knock-on-wood, I have not had a problem with him ever so I will continue to use his barrels and support a local supplier as we all should.
I agree that for +$400 you should get exactly what you ordered, no excuse for that, I am just suprised Dan let a barrel like that out of his shop.
All of the Lilja barrels I have ordered have been very fine finished inside and out. In fact, if the customer wants a matte finished barrel, I have bead blasted them as they come and they turn out great.
From what I have heard with the K-P barrels though, you are correct, they are good shooters at least in the 50 cal versions. Have not heard anything about the conventional bore sizes.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
Being a member of the FCSA is where I have heard all the good things about the K-P barrels.
Skip Talbot is a big supporter of these barrels and if you know anything about this fine fellow, you know these barrels must shoot.
I am sorry to hear about your problems with Dan Lilja. I have ordered and fitted dozens of his barrels without a single problem ever.
Still his shop is still run by human power so there is always the possibility of error.
Knock-on-wood, I have not had a problem with him ever so I will continue to use his barrels and support a local supplier as we all should.
I agree that for +$400 you should get exactly what you ordered, no excuse for that, I am just suprised Dan let a barrel like that out of his shop.
All of the Lilja barrels I have ordered have been very fine finished inside and out. In fact, if the customer wants a matte finished barrel, I have bead blasted them as they come and they turn out great.
From what I have heard with the K-P barrels though, you are correct, they are good shooters at least in the 50 cal versions. Have not heard anything about the conventional bore sizes.
Good Shooting!!!
Kirby Allen(50)
