Hunting rifle accuracy

Discussion in 'Equipment Discussions' started by montana sam, Dec 18, 2005.

  1. montana sam

    montana sam New Member

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    I'm in the market for a new hunting rifle and was wonderin' about the accuracy of out of the box rifles. I just sold my little Remington Mountain Rifle LSS 30-06 because it wouldn't shoot a group to save it's life. I tried several different ammo combinations but nothin seemed to work. It had a new Leupold Vari-X III on it so I assumed it was the guns fault. I'm a little nervous about spending a bunch of money on a Winchester Super Grade III .300WSM, that I have my eye on, only to have a sub-par shooter again. Was the Remington a fluke or is this a major issue regarding these huge gunmakers. The Remington by the way was lucky to keep it in a three inch group at 100 yards. I'd be happy with one inch groups at 100 yards as I will only be shooting at 500 yards maximum for deer and elk. Just want to hear your opinions and rifle suggestions on this matter. Thanks in advance, montana sam
     
  2. Ankeny

    Ankeny Well-Known Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I'd be happy with one inch groups at 100 yards

    [/ QUOTE ]

    To the best of my knowledge, the only factory rifles that have a 1 MOA guarantee are the Varmint weight Savages and the sub-MOA Weatherby. Everything is a crap shoot and if you get a lemon you are at the mercy of the warranty department. For instance, Rugers meet specs with a one inch group at fifty yards. On the bright side there are a lot of factory rifles that will shoot one MOA with the right load. Good luck.
     

  3. bailey1474

    bailey1474 <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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    Forgoy about the Sakos. They have a 1 MOA guarantee.
     
  4. grit

    grit Well-Known Member

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    I've purchased several new winchesters in the last few years. All of them will shoot under one inch at one hundred. They also come with a nice adjustable trigger. Of course, Remingtons have always been reputed to be accurate rifles. I have personally never come across one that shot so poorly. I did own a remington in 6mm with a synthetic stock. The stock was flexible enough, a little pressure on the forend would result in barrell contact and change point of impact.
     
  5. huntem

    huntem Well-Known Member

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    Montana Sam,

    By no means is anyone pointing fingers or blaming anyone but there are way to many variables that come into play as to why your last rifle was less than accurate. Could it been made to shoot..nobody will know.

    At this point, I see that you have a couple options. Buy a used rifle off of a friend that you know is a good shooter. Spend the money on a custom rifle or have an existing rifle rebarreled. No guarantees on accuarcy but I bet if you go to a good gunsmith they can provide some level of acceptance. When I politely asked what my gunsmith's level of acceptance on a "accurate rifle". He smiled and said "The gun will shoot better than you can shoot it. If not, I'll give you one of mine that does". The other option is try your luck with another "guaranteed" rifle from HS precision, Sako, Weatherby.

    BTW, Kimber's level of accuracy is 1.5" @100 yards.
     
  6. keithcandler

    keithcandler Well-Known Member

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    Sam, I am sorry that you have had such bad luck with your LSS. Like the previous poster said, there are many factors that could have contributed to the rifle's inaccuracy. Email me at:keithcandler@msn.com and I will give you a list of things to check some are commonly known and other's are not. I have two 7 Mags in the LSS and they both shoot 2" or less at 400 yards with some tweeking.
     
  7. montana sam

    montana sam New Member

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    Thanks for the replies everyone. There is one issue that I forgot to mention. I used Leupold Dual Dovetail rings and bases and have heard that if the rings are not alingned perfectly they can cause stress on the scope tube resulting in poor accurcy. Could this have been the problem? Anyway I think I'm gonna go with Burris Signature rings next time. Anyone tried these, opinions? Thanks again, montana sam.
     
  8. grit

    grit Well-Known Member

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    I had a scope mounted at the local gun shop once. A Burris in signature rings, in fact. After missing a few things I didn't think I should have, I shot it at paper again. What the ****! Big sloppy erratic groups. The screws had shook loose. I have a rifle that shoots itty bitty groups. Not to get into a scope brand debate, but I put a new leupold on it and: ugly groups. The scope has since been repaired by leupold, and I put 'em on myself. Just a couple of the factors I've experienced.

    I am surprised at kimbers acceptable accuracy. If I was in the market for a new rig, I'd look at the CZ's. Honestly, though, I've no idea how they shoot. My experience has been, most factory rifles will shoot well with a little experimentation.

    Almost forgot, the signature rings are great.
     
  9. ilscungilli

    ilscungilli Well-Known Member

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    I have the signature rings on a Burris, with the Burris double dovetail bases. I have been very pleased with this setup for my 7mm Remmy Mag LSS. The rifle has held the same zero during 3 years of not so nice treatment during Elk and deer hunts.
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    montanasam

    I'm ashamed to say this but the majority of American Rifle Manufacturers have let the "bean counters" control what goes on with the production line and the old time philosophy of making a superior product has gone the way of the wild goose!! Seems that todays philosophy is make it for as cheap as you can and sell it for as high a price as the traffic will bear and don't worry about performance because the majority of the people buying the stuff don't know "Jack" anyway!!

    I've got a very good friend that is a Master Riflemaker and he's been telling me for ten years or more that most of the firearms coming into his place for accuracy work are terrible pieces of XXXT with internal action threads not in line with the centerline of the action, bolt lugs out of alignment, front of actions not squared, etc.!!

    Sad....but true!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif
     
  11. nighthunter264wm

    nighthunter264wm Well-Known Member

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    You can take your chances on getting a good one, or do a precision build that you can be happy with, for a long time. I prefer option #2 because I am very picky and am not happy until I can shoot a group into one ragged hole at 100 yds. This way I know I'm good at longer distances.
     
  12. Bart B

    Bart B Well-Known Member

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    Montana Sam, I don't mean to burst any bubbles you may have about accuracy, but a rifle and ammo combination that shoots 1 inch at 100 yards ain't gonna shoot 5 inches at 500 yards or 1 minute of angle through 500 yards; if that's what you're thinking.

    Depending on muzzle velocity spread and fired bullet quality, your 500-yard accuracy with that stuff can easily be 20 inches or more.

    Groups don't keep the same angular measurement as range increases; they get bigger and bigger and bigger.....
     
  13. BountyHunter

    BountyHunter Writers Guild

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    Good rule of thumb is 2x the group size in MOA for actual realistic groups at distance.

    .5MOA group at 100 will normally be 10" at 1000

    Now that might be better or worse, but good planning figure and that is with top quality guns and reloads.

    BH
     
  14. scottjohnson

    scottjohnson Member

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    My personal favorite gun in my rack is a post 64, push feed, m70 in 270 cal. It shoots factory Fed. Fusion 150's sub MOA. I have however full beeded it into a Brown Precision fiberglass stock. My gun and other 270 rifles with 1 in 10 twists like the longer 150 grain bullets and struggle to group the 130's. I don't know if you have tried reloading or experimented with premium ammo but my experience is that most guns will find a combination that they like. Again ditto what others referenced in regards to bedding or floating. Off the rackers may still need to be tweeked! Good luck /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif