how important is ARC?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by Wheatgerm, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. Wheatgerm

    Wheatgerm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    I have a Bushnell 1500 arc right now but I want to upgrade to a leica 1600, if I've read it right the CRF series does not have angle compensation but the new 1600-B series does... well the difference is 600$-800$. Im on a budget and would really like to pay 600$ lol...
    a friend of mine doesn't have the arc and says unless it's extreme up or downhill he just dials for the exact distance and aims low. Depending how low depends on his shot angle but he gives it an educated guess.
    just looking for more opinions. Do I get the CRF and hold my wet finger in the air to decide how many yards to cut :) or do I save for technology
    I already know what is the better out of the two. Just trying to decide if its worth the extra money
     
  2. BrentM

    BrentM Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,550
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2013
    I have the Leica 1600B. It's worth it to me. I personally think guessing is unethical and irresponsible. If you are shooting LR get the gizmo's that go along with it and make your shots on animals be as accurate and feasible as possible. There is another thread where there is a little debate going on about the accuracy of angle compensation. The idea is that normal angle compensation theory and math is not accurate for extreme angles. I am thinking anything less than 25 degrees is going to fine with a ARC if the theory about the accuracy is correct. I don't now about the other Leica's but the 1600B does have slope angle, temp, and absolute barometric pressure as well. These are the things I use to input into my computer to give me a solid shooter result.
     

  3. mrb1982

    mrb1982 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    674
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2012
    I guess I would think the regular 1600 would be fine. I bought it. I figure guys have been having a lot of success with it before the 1600-B came out. Is the B version better, most likely. Is it required, probably not.
     
  4. midwesthunter

    midwesthunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    845
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2008
    DOn't worry about ARC, most ballistic programs you can enter the angle of the shot anyways, so just get a angle gauge and attach to the rifle or scope.
     
  5. BrentM

    BrentM Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,550
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2013
    So an angle guage or Angle Cosine Indicator and mount cost how much? $200?

    Perhaps the most important question at this time is what range are you shooting, what sort of scope do you have, MOA, BDC, etc. Do you have a computer? I assume you do not since you mentioned using the kentucky windage or good ol guesstimation process.
     
  6. Canadian Bushman

    Canadian Bushman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,650
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    The crf1600 will give you the angle of the shot it just wont correct for it. If you shoot modest ranges shot angles under 10 deg dont have alot of effect. For instance a -10 degree shot at 600yds for my 308 load is about .3 moa. IMO the crf 1600 and a calculator will do just fine.
     
  7. Wheatgerm

    Wheatgerm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    Sorry for the delayed response I lost internet service for a while. Thanks for all the replies.

    Brent I was joking when I was talking about holding my finger in the air for windage.
    as for distances I shoot to 1000 at the range but I think as for now 800 would be my max in a hunting scenario in perfect conditions. I use MOA turrets and I do have a accurate ballistics calculator on my phone that will adjust for angle. I was unaware that the 1600CRF will tell the angle Slope so really I will have to type the yardage into my calculator anyways and if the crf gives the angle then I really see no need to spend the extra money.
    Please correct me if im wrong anywhere? Thanks
     
  8. royinidaho

    royinidaho Writers Guild

    Messages:
    8,853
    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2004
    Hmmm, I have a 1600 and with a push of the front button get angle and temperature.
     
  9. Wheatgerm

    Wheatgerm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    What model of the 1600 do you have? My thinking is i'll have to calculate for my turret adjustment anyways. So if I have the angle then it won't be hard to punch that in as well
     
  10. BrentM

    BrentM Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,550
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2013
    If the CRF gives you the slope then I think I would go that route. The 1600B bc part is only good for 500 yards anyway. I do think it is a nice feature and if you have it set up correctly will give a good results for a quick adjustment. For example, if I input a ballistic selection close to my DOPE I can range anything to the 500 mark and get a solution that will be accurate for hunting. This will take into account, ABP, Temp, Slope, Range, and bullet drop. I can set the unit on MOA and it will give me a MOA solution to dial on the scope.

    I failed to test it this weekend, just flat forgot. I need to set the unit on a BC program and see if it still ranges past the maximum solution yardage. For example I ranged a group of rocks at 1982 yards on the standard setting. I am not sure if it will do that on the BC setting.
     
  11. Wheatgerm

    Wheatgerm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    That makes sense. That's why my Bushnell arc will only range to 1000yards on the arc mode but will range further on normal mode. I have had great results with the Bushnell on trees and rocks out to 1000 but I can't pick up a deer, cow, or elk past 600 this is why im hoping the leica will be better for ranging the actual animal.
    I mostly hunt flat desert sage country so there really isn't enough angle to make much of a difference below 500my yards in most senerios for me.

    Can anyone confirm for me if the normal 1600crf will tell you the angle. But just doesn't figure the "hold to" yardage? I haven't had time to look for myself
     
  12. Canadian Bushman

    Canadian Bushman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,650
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    Yes the leica crf 1600 will give you the angle of object ranged.
     
  13. Canadian Bushman

    Canadian Bushman Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,650
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2012
    And temperature, and barometric pressure
     
  14. Wheatgerm

    Wheatgerm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    176
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    Perfect! The B that cuts yardage would be nice but not needed in my opinion for my used. Thanks for the help everyone.

    Can anyone share how well the lace ranges on a deer in flat country? Maybe in the worst case senerio really bright day or fog ect