How far really?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by alloutsmith3, Apr 26, 2011.

  1. alloutsmith3

    alloutsmith3 Well-Known Member

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    Whats the actual number or percentage of game animals being taken over 600 yds or are most taken under 600 yds?

    Also how often do snipers take tactical shots and engage their targets over 600 yds or are most shots taken under 600 yds?

    Thanks guys.
     
  2. bota

    bota Well-Known Member

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    There is a recent poll on this site regarding the distance at which members of this forum have taken game. Not sure about military and LE snipers?
     

  3. Long Time Long Ranger

    Long Time Long Ranger Well-Known Member

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    The numbers over 600 yards are so insignificant they don't even register. Most are taken well less than that from the elk camps I have been in and know of. Now a few long range guys are out there and take them over 600 yards but they are few by total numbers of big game hunters. The past five years for me out of several bulls the closest was probably near 600 to a long of 908 yards. But I know I can take them at long range so don't bother stalking when I don't need to. I usually set up to cover quite a bit of country.
     
  4. sp6x6

    sp6x6 Well-Known Member

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    Watch Shawn C. videos he connects regular past 1000. I have bench buddies that shoot antelope at 1000 + on purpose, one filled a doe tag at just under 1600, this is with there bench guns, not a normal type hunting. I tried to think back, AND for this forum, I dont really consider myself in the long range, but I am working on it.I have 3 bulls pushing 600.One 600, one 650, and one 845.Couple of speed goats 550,540.Bear 540. I will admit I have missed my fair share, and clean, on wind calls, mostly.Coyote at 540 also.I am getting help from my bench rest friends, which is a tremendous help, they shoot long and read wind , and mirage all the time, have to be on it with the light bullets.
     
  5. RockyMtnMT

    RockyMtnMT Official LRH Sponsor

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    I can say that for me it is easier to get a shot under 300 yards than it is to get a shot past 600 yards. Don't get me wrong, not harder to make the shot, harder to get the shot.

    Hunted hard last year to get a good shot at 840 yards. My buddy made the shot and I called it. It took 7 days of hunting and turning down shorter shots.

    Steve
     
  6. huntaz

    huntaz Member

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    The average LE sniper shot is around 70 yards in an urban environment. I work for a city department and it is unusual to have shots that are much past 100 yards. We use a Bearcat Armored vehicle were we can put a sniper in the turret in front of the house, or across the street on a roof or just about anywhere so shots are not usually very far. If at all possible we have one high and one low. There are only a few places that we might have long shots and that is at one of our airports. I do not know about military.

    Rod
     
  7. sniperjwt

    sniperjwt Well-Known Member

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    I think for most people (myself included) its not a matter of consistantly shooting an animal at 600+ yards every time you go out. It is a matter of if i have the oppratunity to harvest an animal at that range will i be prepared. That is why i practice to 1000yds. Have i ever shot an animal that far away. No i have not, but if the situation arrises where i have a chance to then i am confident that i will be able to make the shot. In the normal stand that i sit in during rifle season i can see 500yds to my left 450 in front and 800 to my right. Most shots are inside of 300 but have made shots out to 580 from that stand. If you go by all hunters all over the world and the game they have taken i would say that most likely less than 1 percent is actually harvested past the 600yd mark.
    Same goes for the military you want to practice as far as your equipment will allow you to although for most operations the shot will be under 600yds.
     
  8. SBruce

    SBruce Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what the actual percentage is, but it is very low I am sure. Although it's low currently, it is on the increase.

    I've guided deer and antelope hunters for nearly 30 years, and I've only witnessed a handful of kills beyond 500 yds. I've witnessed alot of misses though, misses by guys that weren't prepared enough or practiced enough to make the shots they were attempting.

    Granted, only the last few years has the "long range" thing really caught on. And the technology caught up enough that people are now making those long shot kills with far less time behind the gun than it required 10 or 15 years ago.
    15 years ago, the only way to know where we had to aim at 700 yds was by shooting and practicing/keeping records at that distance ahead of time. We didn't have the ballistic programs or the rangefinders that would read that far.

    Even today, I would bet a paycheck that most people attempting long distance shots are not properly prepared and consequently, there are way more long distance misses than hits. The new tech is nice, but it's got alot of people thinking they can do it without prior "homework" or practice.
     
  9. sniperjwt

    sniperjwt Well-Known Member

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    so very true
     
  10. Shawn Carlock

    Shawn Carlock Sponsor

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    It has been my experience that even in "long range circles" that the % of shooters that are consistantly taking game past 600 yards is small. This might be because of opportunity, ability or equipment. Some people setup to shoot long but most simply prepare to shoot long if the situtation requires it. We get alot of long shots because of terrain and we look for areas to shoot into that are other wise difficult or impossible to hunt.
    On the military LE sniping - LE sniping is 99% a close range affair with a moving and partially obscured target. Engagements of 100 or 200 yards are possible and long shots in the airport scenerio are possible but I have not ever seen any reviews of shots longer than 200 yards in LE incidents.
    The military guys I have talked with (Navy Dev Group, STA guys and Snipers attached to Range groups) are all pretty much of the same opinion, that most sniping currently consists of 600 yards and in, quick engagement simi urban sniping and 1000 yard + open country sniping. They all pretty much agree that the 600 yard work is their bread and butter so to speak but they have to have real 1200 yard + capability for certain work even though it makes up a fairly small percentage of their work load.
     
  11. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    Just doing a lot of reading, talking with current military, and documentaries, the role of the sniper has changed. What use to be a one or two man crew is now a crew of three or more especially for urban environments. They have run into the problems of being ambushed from behind when held up in a building providing a support role. So they move in a little bigger group.

    When in towns and cities their shots are from a 20 or 30 yards up to 600 depending on their position. One recorded sniper sat for an afternoon picking taliban off out to 600yrds watching down a street trying to run from building to building to get close enough (Via History channel). The need for better calibers other than the .308 Win. is why we see a lot of hype about the 338 Lapua and 300WM. They need that support much farther out than what they are use too. 50BMG sniper systems are being used quite often and with good effect.

    Out in the field they have had to change tactics both at company level through military policy on fighting. The Taliban has learned that "most" soldiers can't hit much past 300m with the M16 and M4's. So the Taliban move back into a position just outside of effective range and launch their attacks with rockets, mortars and heavy machines guns. They know if they get too close they will more than likely be killed. So the Military has adopted squad level marksman for this purpose. They are usually issued an M14 highly modified or the M110 (I believe) for those long shots. These guys are supporting platoons and companies in excess of 600m. The battle field is now a long range battle verses traditional up close and personal battle.

    Sniper teams have been deployed in higher numbers for this war than any other war that I can think of. The necessity of shooting 800m plus is in a much higher demand than ever. Because of the terrain it is also suitable to the snipers abilities.

    Tank
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2011
  12. alloutsmith3

    alloutsmith3 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all the replies guys, I appreciate all the input.
     
  13. RDM416

    RDM416 Well-Known Member

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    If you are talking about "all" hunters I would say the number is very, very small. If you are asking individuals on this site, the number will go up by a great deal although as others have said the percentage of shots over 600 is still quite small.

    I usually manage to get at least one big game kill each fall that is over 600, but I am set up and looking for those kind of shots. Last fall for example I killed an elk at 605, an antelope at 815, and one at 935 then a whitetail at 340. That would make 75% of my kills last hunting season at 600+ yards. Normally it would be just the opposite with 4 or 5 critters killed under 600 and maybe 1 over. Obviously antelope provide lots of long range opportunities and I elk in some very open country in southern NM, so kind of like LTLR said in an earlier post, when I see them within 1000 yards (depending on conditions) I am going to shoot them rather than stalk closer.
     
  14. midnightmalloy

    midnightmalloy Well-Known Member

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    Sniper overwatch is now the norm in iraq. I will not devulge all the info and for my friends we should not continue the military side of this conversation. U all want to know but anyone has access to this site so let's just speculate and not inform anyone who doesn't need to know.