Discussion in 'Product Reviews - Discussion' started by ADMIN, Sep 10, 2009.

Hensoldt Storms The US Market

  1. ADMIN

    ADMIN Administrator

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    This is a thread for discussion of the article, Hensoldt Storms The US Market, By David M. Fortier. Here you can ask questions or make comments about the article.
     
  2. HUAINAMACHERO

    HUAINAMACHERO Well-Known Member

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    Impressive, one more scope to consider for my next rifle project.
    Thanks for the article, very interesting and very well written.
     

  3. phorwath

    phorwath Well-Known Member

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    Nice article on another tactical scope option for those that have the financial resources and are willing to carry a heavy scope and pay for top-tier optics.

    Thanks for sharing this information and conclusions from your examination of your loaner/test models. An educational read on the Hensoldts.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2009
  4. Joaquin B

    Joaquin B Well-Known Member

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    Very nice article. However, the author has probably never heard of Schmidt und Bender, the premier GERMAN telecopic sight manufacturer. S & B probably make the best scopes on earth. I'd like to own one someday.

    JB
     
  5. JRu

    JRu Well-Known Member

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    Anybody aware of Hensoldt's existence is most likely very familiar with Zeiss and S&B.

    Personally I *do* think Hensoldt makes better scopes than S&B -- I've owned both a Hensoldt 3-12x56 FF and a S&B PMII 5-25x56 LP P4F, and I preferred the Hensoldt. Now they are both gone and I shoot a Zeiss Victory Diavari 3-12x56 mil-dot with the new ASV elevation turret, it's better for my purposes, but if I had to choose again ( and I might, depending on how things turn out on a LR project rifle ) , I'd probably pick the Hensoldt over S&B.

    These are top tier manufacturers and the differences are mostly fractions of a percent in any objectively measurable attribute, boiling really down to personal preference. It's just that I like the extreme optical and mechanical quality of Hensoldt, combined with compact size and good ergonomics. If I had to suggest improvements on the Hensoldt, the only thing I'd really come up with is a Gen 2 mildot reticle.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2009
  6. jdlotto

    jdlotto Member

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    I concur, SCHMIDT&BENDER is top of the line scopes I currently own the 5x25x56with a 34mm tube and a PM 11 / P4F reticule on top a Accuracy International 50BMG shoots out to a mile without a glitch and transitions flawless, it was costly but worth the investment. I had previously (shortly ,1Hour) owned the Heinstelt 5x25 top of the line also the glass was not as good as i was told (not sharp enough) plus it had a black spec in the lens.When i am going to pay $3600.00 dollars for a scope it better be flawless..I am currently looking at the 5x25x56 with 34mm tube that Premier Reticule makes Does anybody have a first hand experiance (owns one) ontheir new models with flip top turrets ????? good or bad transitioning and quality of the glass in good weather and bad weather ??
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2009
  7. JRu

    JRu Well-Known Member

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    What is a "Heinstelt 5x25"?

    If you compare S&B and Hensoldt side by side ( which I've done, often, with several scopes ) , you'll see the glass on Hensoldt is on par or slightly better than S&B. In fact, it's pretty easy to recognize S&B's weak spot when compared to Zeiss and Hensoldt.

    Hensoldt's weakness is the mechanicals, here in Finland four out of five Hensoldts I know of have been returned to factory for repairs, mostly due to lenses cracking or coming loose on top of 338LM, and the latest problem a friend of mine had with his 3-12x56 FF was the rheostat breaking.

    So? I had to return my S&B PM II 5-25x56 L/P P4F to factory because it had a spec of dust on the lens system inside. Hardly a conclusive sample size to judge all S&B's.

    These are the top 1% of scopes sold anywhere in the world so the differences really are insignificant. But your review of "Heinstelt 5x25" is not very convincing, if you're trying to refer to the Hensoldt 6-24. If there really exists a "Heinstelt 5x25" , you just might be correct it's inferior to S&B, as I have never heard of it...
     
  8. jdlotto

    jdlotto Member

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    Jru ,Well as i just had got off a 12 hour day ,yes the numbers are off it was a 6x24 and the spelling was off. And yes they are the top1 percent of the scopes made.But ive look looked threw a lot of glass and wasn't compelled to say that the glass on the Hensoldt 6x24 was all that. I couldn't see clarity when focusing out long distancees and this is what it is all about CLARITY, not a little spec of dust this was a pretty big BLACK SPOT. You have your opinion of scopes and this was mine. Dont get your underwear in a bunggie...
     
  9. JRu

    JRu Well-Known Member

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    I've shot up to a mile, participated in sniper competitions and hunted both day- and nighttime with both Hensoldts and S&B's and I disagree completely with what you're saying. Either you had a lemon for a Hensoldt, didn't get it focused right ( Hensoldts can be particularily picky about diopter adjustment ) or you're just being brand loyal, I don't know which. Nor do I really care but I just like to get it out there that your experience does not represent the general line of Hensoldt users.

    OK now you do realize what a spec of dust looks like when it's magnified? My guess is your black spot isn't actually the size of a pirate ship either.

    No worries my friend, takes a lot more to adjust my underwear :D
     
  10. jdlotto

    jdlotto Member

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    Jru ,, Nice to know you have a good sense of Humor also .I tried to focus the diopter with no success maybe it was a lemon, Loyalty to what works is my only concern. If i was a writer though i"m sure i would of written up a bad review because that's what they gave me , I realize every once in a while your gonna get a turd in the fish bowl. I was hoping to have it work cause i wanted to use it in conjunction with the spotting scope, since they are both set up for mills and you can harmoniously work them together for adjusting easily when shooting competition's and fun shoot"s or Hunting LD...
    So what is your choice of Long Distance guns to shoot over there in Finland ?? I'm shooting a Sako TRG42-338 and a 50BMG Accuracy Int. The Sako is a hair splitter and so is the other.I shoot a number of competitions mostly all military bases here in the states and a lot of fun shoots with buddies out west in Wyoming.Woops gotta get my butt to work talk to ya a little later on..Good day
     
  11. JRu

    JRu Well-Known Member

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    We don't really have a "LRH" tradition here as our forests are thick, 99% of the shots are 200 or closer. The few of us who shoot/hunt long range, shoot pretty much what the rest of the world does; Mostly .308Win, 6.5x284 , 338LM.

    I had a TRG-42 ( the 5-25 S&B was on top of that ) but I sold it as it sickened me to see it just gather dust in the gun cabinet. I had it out a couple of times a year for ELR shooting and competitions.

    I simply started to think of 338LM as overkill for paper/plate shooting and TRG + S&B 5-25 as too heavy ( 16 lbs ) for a practical carry rifle. These days I prefer the mediums and I think I'm pretty well covered; For our type of hunting ( <500 ) I've got a real tack driver TRG-S 30-06, and for those occasions I get to stretch it a bit, I'll pull out the 7mm RM that will match 338LM trajectory with 168 or 180 VLDs or 175 SMKs. Not too thin for hunting should opportunity arise, and not overkill for plain old paper punching. Your mileage may vary, naturally, but this is where I ended up.

    Of course, with the TRG-S there's always the option of going big as it's the 338LM size action. So far I've had zero need, and I sure don't miss the cost of shooting & reloading a 338LM size cartridge...

    Sorry for the thread hijack. I'll just conclude we Finns have considerable experience with both Hensoldts and S&Bs and choosing between them should come down to simply a matter of taste over their implementations of key features; DT vs. multi-turn turret, rheostat placement and function, reticle selection, etc.
     
  12. HuDisCo

    HuDisCo <b>Official LRH Sponsor</b>

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    We have never had a 6-24x56 returned for reticle debris. I did have a 6-24x72 once that had a small spec that was cleaned and returned to one of our IL dealers. Could this be your scope?

    The warrany issues have been easy for me to keep up with as there have only been 2 cases out of hundreds of scopes. We have only had a total of 4 scopes returned for repair. 2 for warranty and 2 for negligent damage.

    As for the clarity, this has never been a cause for concern when compared to any other brand. There is no doubt that there are other manufacturers that make a good scope as well, but we do have some definate advanges in technology that give us an edge. :)

    Without more details, I really can't speak about your initial experience, but I would invite you to give one another try.

    Either way, thanks for the comments.

    Best regards,

    Nathan Hunt
     
  13. Chas1

    Chas1 Well-Known Member

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    Before I'd buy I have one question. The article was well written and packed with just about every piece of info you'd want from techy to 200 years of world history...BUT, oddly enough at least to me the author states "Up until today the Hensoldt line had been unavailable to American riflemen. For whatever reason, these military products were not offered here". Come on, with all that info collected for the article clearly there are contacts within the circle that know the answer. IMHO it's beyond odd that twice in the article it came up and there was no thought given to find out...or maybe they did and the real answer might not be to politically correct for the average American Shooter. The U.S. market for scopes is huge and it begs the question why didn't they market/sell here?
     
  14. HuDisCo

    HuDisCo <b>Official LRH Sponsor</b>

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    There was certainly no malicious intent toward American shooters... This is an interesting point. I never thought someone might take it that way, so I am glad you brought it up. You must realize that the long range shooting industry has really only developed commercially on a large scale here probably within the last 10 years, give or take a few.

    To my understanding a large part of it is due to cultural differences between us and Germany. Carl Zeiss Optronics produces only military and LE products. Military products are simply not sold to commercial users there. The political climate seems to be much more liberal. For almost all German sportsmen and shooters their needs were met by the Sport Optics line.

    The Zeiss company is also particular about who they will do business with and before myself there were no suitable companies to partner with to handle importation and distribution.

    There are many more reasons than this, but these are the main ones I think.

    I hope that helps.

    Best regards,

    Nathan Hunt