I was talking about shooting at work today during lunch and one of the guys asked what I was shooting. I told him 220 swift. I told him that I loved it, but traded it for a .270 cuz I could shoot farther with it. He said shoot, a 220 swift will shoot 500 yards, I said ya I know, but thats about it, I wanted something for out to around 800. Anyways, he went on to say that any 22-250 can be loaded "faster then a swift". I just kinda thought, OK buddy, your one of those guys. He proceeds to tell me, those loads in the manual dont mean anything, you can go over by 1-2-3 grains. He was claiming to get 4500 fps with a 58g vmax out of a 243, no cronograph. I was also thinking, jeez this guy, cant and wont get anything across to him. I simply said a 22-250 wont outdo a swift, and he said, if you know what your doing it will. I about laughed. I didn't have enough time to finish, however I doubt any of it woulda worked!!!