extream LR bullet expansion on game

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Coyboy, Mar 7, 2011.

  1. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Guys I am looking for first hand experience with bullets on game at 1200 to 2000 yards.

    I need to know cartrige, bullet, impact velocity (aprox), animal, and shot placement/effect.

    Mostly looking for 30, 338, 375 cal. info.
    Trying to work my way into an extream LR rig in 2 years time.

    The longest shot to date that I have 1st hand witness to is 1180y on a Mule deer with a 200AB out of a 300 rum, impact velocity of 1800fps.
    Bullet expanded and exited, breaking one rib on the in side and leaving a 1.2 inch hole thru the vitals.
     
  2. jmason

    jmason Well-Known Member

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    Jim- give Kevin a call. He and JUDD killed a doe this year with his 338-408 around 1550 yds this year with a 300SMK. He'd probably have some good info for you. I know he has had some additional experience with that bullet and other chamberings out pretty far as well.
     

  3. Buffalobob

    Buffalobob Writers Guild

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  4. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    With the 300 gr SMK (I have shot a few animals with these at a varity of distances) you can expect full penetration on a deer on most shots out to 1900+ as long as you don't get into the shoulder very much. If you have an impact velocity of 1800 fps or more you will get pretty good bullet expansion most of the time. I like to shoot bone so I am drawn to the deep penetrating traits of the SMK an like the fact that most of the time it still expands. I have shot 3 elk over 1000, 1 black bear and a hand full of whitetails none showed huge exit wounds, all dropped within 30 yards and most dropped where they stood. I give credit to shot placement and penetration as expansion was not a contributing factor on an of them. Hope this helps make it clear.

    Mark,

    On the 1935 yards shot, you will be ablew to see the DVD soon but here is the quick and dirty version of bullet performance:

    Impact velocity was 1280 fps and about 1100 ft/lbs
    Shot was quartering to, inpact was mid ribcage entry and exit half way between the ribcage and front of the hip on the off side.
    Exit wound was not visible until skinned and was about the size of a nickel.
    Animal moved about 30 yards and folded.
    __________________
    Shawn Carlock

    ..::Defensive Edge - Custom Gunsmithing::..
    1-208-687-2659

    I found this in your link Bob, thank you.
    Shawn has alot of knowledge I wish he was here a little bit more I always enjoy reading his stuff.

    I don't want this thread to turn into a debate, I'm more interested in bullet expansion thresh-holds in velocity and yardages by first hand experience.

    Thanks
     
  5. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    I have some info on two 1130 yard shots with 300 smk's. But you requested 1200 plus. Let me know if you want what I got.

    Good thread!!

    Thanks

    Jeff
     
  6. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Hey there BB... did you find some coffee grinds in the bottom of your cup this morning. I hate when that happens and I have to spit them out of my teeth and mouth. :)
     
  7. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Yes Jeff, give up the beans, I would be curios how they worked at thast distance
    I have only shot one Mule deer with the 300 smk at a meager 660 yards. The bullet upset and did a fine job, but by no means was the wound channel excessive. really could not distigish it from a hole left by a 308 with cup and core bullets. So in that instance I was pleased it did not ruin alot of meat.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2011
  8. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    Both were from my .338 LM 10 twist 27.5" Lilja. 300 SMK ver H-1000 with a MV of 2805.


    First was a kansas WT doe at 1137 yards feeding in a tilled grain field hillside. I have inpact velocity at 1668 fps. She was full broadside and the POI was right at the back of the ribcage and caught the back rib on exit. Bullet made a full pass through and in the video you could see 2 or 3 small distinctive dust clouds on the other side of the deer. So the bullet broke up but must have been pretty good sized chunks. Probably did it as it exited on that rib. Exit hole was fairly large as I remember like 2".

    Second was a Bull Elk at 1130 yards. I have impact velocity at 1674. It was 3/4 facing me and I took a high near shoulder for POA. My wind call was off and the bullet landed about 12" left at the base of the neck. Again full pass through with a smaller exit of about 1".

    Both animals dropped where the stood.

    Jeff
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2011
  9. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Jeff when you field dressed the elk what type of internal damage was noted?
    Did the bullet hit any bone? and with the quartering shot into the base of the neck where about was the exit hole?
     
  10. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    I said 3/4 facing me but you know how hard it is to determin at this distance through a scope. The Bulls head was to the left and I could easily tell he was not broadside and was "somewhat" facing me. So my point of aim was for the "front left corner" of him. I was hoping to either get the shoulder or if I was off get the brisket or neck as the way he was facing it would not have taken much of a miss right to be in the salad bowl. The wind was right to left and took me left into the neck. Sorry I only field dressed him and didn't skin him. It was 8:30 pm by the time I got him loaded and first thing in the am he was off to the butcher. So I don't know what the bullet hit on it's way through, but it must have been somehing good as he literally rared up and fell over backwards and never kicked. The exit was right at the frot edge of the far shoulder where the neck starts. If it had been any farther back it would probably have been very close or into the shoulder bone. Hope I explaned this well enough. Kinda hard, but think of a narrow target with only the front corner of the shoulder and neck for a desired point of impact with only about 1 moa left or right for a desired hit.


    I want to add this pic. It is not what you wanted for distance but may be of interest. This is a 300 SMK from My Lapua @ 2805 MV and an impact velocity of 2235 fps. Distance was 526 yards. This was from a previous Bull Elk, an older 6x6. Entrance was at the back of the near shoulder, and bullet stopped under the hide after penetrating the far shoulder too. Bullet retained about 60% of it's weight.

    Jeff

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
  11. elkaholic

    elkaholic Well-Known Member

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    Jim...Did you recover that bullet? If so, how MUCH did it expan?d
     
  12. elkaholic

    elkaholic Well-Known Member

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    Jim....Try this! Measure the meplat on a Berger or SMK, then drill out the tip with a bit 1/2 of the diameter. Don't go into the lead but just through the jacket. Fill the resulting void with silicon flush with tip. The idea is to thin the jacket a little at the nose and the silicon will create a hydraulic action to start expansion. This will not change the b.c. or accuracy. You can use the factory version for close range and the modified ones at long range with no POI difference:D....Rich
     
  13. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Good idea Rich :)
     
  14. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    No I don't believe Matt found it, zipped right thru, but from the intenal damage it apeared to have expanded well.

    On the tip mods. I talked to Nate today and he had been kicking around the idea of a 375 chey tac with 350smk, (Ididn't see them on seirras web-site last I checked)

    The discusion was to tim the metplat back to create a bit flatter and larger tip, knowing there will be a slight loss of BC but also a more consistant bc from bullet to bullet. Hoping in the end expansion might be a bit better.

    Nathan and I also discussed his 300 smk shots on deer and he had a few stories of no expansion and deer traveling quite a ways with just a vent hole thru and thru.
    He said if he goes back to a 338 he'll try the 285 a-max. That bullet I have not even seen yet.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2011