Budget Build Help - Laminate or not?

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by SBD, Mar 9, 2012.

  1. SBD

    SBD Member

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    Hey guys, so I'm getting my 18yr old son into the rifle shooting game. He has been shooting shotguns for a few years bird hunting and what-not. But now he wants to build a rifle to start getting into this. He's a full time college student who works part time, and I told him I'd match him dollar-for-dollar in helping him fund his build. So after a few months of him drooling over Senderos and Savage Model 10 FCPs, we picked up a nice, lightly used Remington 700 ADL sporter in 7mm-08 with the plastic stock. (I have the same gun in .243 but I will have a "slightly larger" budget)

    With the initial gun purchased, he is moving to optics and a stock. Thinking of something like a 10x Bushnell Elite - I think that's good for a 7mm-08, will allow him to learn target turrets and mil-dots, is within his budget, and it's not made in China - It's been my experience that at that price range, fixed power is more durable. Any other sub $400 options?

    We'd like to send the action out to a good smith to have it worked and the trigger tuned. Ideally we'd like to get the stock 1st and send em out together. Montour County Rifles has an accuracy package that beds the stock and works the action and trigger for $300 - That's what we're shooting for

    As far as stocks, the laminates from Boyd's and Stocky's are right in his budget wheelhouse and we'd grab a set of Pillar bedding blocks. Finding an aftermarket stock for an ADL blind mag (that is actually in stock) is a lot harder than we thought. Sure we could get BDL bottom metal and a BDL stock, but that is going to add $100+ to the build, and for something that people end up upgrading anyways. I had a floor-plate Savage that used to pop open and dump out the ammo on me. So we figured a blind mag was cheaper to buy and will stay shut.

    So are the laminates worth it? How close to "drop in" are they? Has anyone used the newer Stocky's made by Revolution? He is 5'7 and wears a medium glove. How large is the palm swell on a thumbhole? Or should we wait and hold out for a composite with an aluminum bedding block - Seems like the one we'd get is the H-S Precision Pro Series 2000 for $340

    Thanks guys... He'd be super excited to see what you guys thought about his build, and any advice is GREATLY appreciated
     
  2. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    You can buy a Richard's Micro Fit. They have a pretty low price. But I really like the Hart laminates that are offered at Stocky's. As for which to buy... it's up to you. Does he want the laminate look, or the water proof durability of the composite/fiber glass stocks. B&C are great options for affordability. I use one and it works great in my Savage.

    The scope's, you could look at Viper Vortex, Falcon Menace, Nikon Buckmaster, and Millet. All of these would be good lesser expensive models. I currently own a Nikon Buckmaster 4.5-14x40 that I have had on two .308's, a 300WSM, and a 22LR. They are really nice glass and durable. I've also owned the Buckmaster 6-18x40 I used on my 300WSM. It worked really well and both are repeatable in turning the turrets. I sold the Nikon for a Viper Vortex 6.5-20x44. I couldn't be happier. I've read that the Falcon Menace is a very good option and guys seem to like the Millets.
     

  3. Dr. Vette

    Dr. Vette Well-Known Member

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    Interesting build.

    If it were me (and it's not) with that budget I'd think about...

    This scope:
    http://www.longrangehunting.com/for...5-20x44-plex-riflescopes-back-279-99-a-86253/

    Very nice optics, allows you to play with turrets and powers, and virtually unbeatable for the price. We own 3 of them at present.


    I'd look at these stocks:
    * BLOWOUT * Long Range Sporter (LRS) Remington 700 798 BDL SPS, Mauser 98 / Interarms Mark X Sporters, Weatherby Vanguard / Howa 1500 Savage 10 Stevens 200 SA Laminated Thumbhole FBC Riflestock LIQUIDATION

    *NEW* Heritage Classic Sporter Stocks - Remington 700 ADL BDL , Ruger 77 Mark 2, Savage 10 / 110, Winchester 70 / 70a / 670, Weatherby Vanguard

    Bell & Carlson Alaskan Wilderness / Mountain Rifle Remington Model 700 / Model Seven (7) Stock - Right & Left Hand Available - NEW Models!

    However, I would plan on adding pillars to any of the laminate stocks, and skim bedding whichever one you choose. They're all 3 going to be "close" but will probably need a tiny bit of finessing to get correct.
     
  4. SBD

    SBD Member

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    On the Nikon... I have the exact same scope on my hunting rifle! You're right, they are really nice glass, about the best I looked through in the <$300 category. What type of turrets are you using? If we could use this scope, I could just convince the wife that the money we saved could offset MY new scope (-:

    As far as the durability of laminate. I was up in Canada shooting geese last winter and the guide had 2 laminate stocked rifles in his gun case. According to him, a properly done laminate will be every bit as durable and weather resistant as a composite (just what he told me). Is that not true? - As for looks, my kid is pretty handy with his air brush, so I'm sure it will be wearing some sort of tactical camo pattern in short time.

    At any rate, thanks so much for the reply!
     
  5. SBD

    SBD Member

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    The "Blowout LRS" is out of stock on the ADL and they won't be getting more as Stocky's is switching to the Revolution line (like stock #2). The Heritage is an option, and one of the ones we are considering. The B&C again is not in stock (as most of the ADL stocks we find) Also it is a mountain rifle stock, how does that differ from the factory 700 contour? The only composite we have found "in stock" and under $500 is the H-S Precision Sporter 2000 I mentioned, and it is $340 shipped from Stocky's -
     
  6. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    There is nothing wrong with H-S stocks. Companies use them on there top end factory rifles. That says something for there quality. Laminates are definitely better than a standard single piece of hardwood. But they are still made of wood which if not sealed properly is susceptible to temp change and humidity. That is why you see some of the laminates with pillar bedding, aluminum bedding blocks. The unpillard stocks, and pillar bedded stocks usually get the devcon treatment or marine tex bedding. This helps to negate the problems of wood changing shape caused by weather.

    If your son is planning on painting, then I would strongly suggest a composite stock. If you want to enjoy the beauty the laminates offer, then I would go that route.

    From my understanding Nikon make target turrets that you can put on the Buckmasters now. The turrets that are on it are very easy to read and a low profile design. But the target turrets would be a bonus in my opinion. I will have to look into them myself one of these days. If you get the 6-18, they come with target turrets and what they call tactical turrets. The only thing about the 6-18 is that it is an 1/8MOA adjustment compared to the 1/4MOA adjustment of the 4.5-14. I really like both my scopes. It's a toss up really between the Vortex and the Nikon. I've been extremely happy with both. Customer service at both companies are top notch.
     
  7. Dr. Vette

    Dr. Vette Well-Known Member

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    If Stocky's doesn't have one in stock, they usually have them in quickly.

    Call them if there is one you like in a B&C and see when they may get the next shipment in. The mountain rifle stock is a bit slimmer in the grip and slimmer overall.

    Boyds also has ADL long action stocks:
    Replacement Stocks for Remington Rifles and Shotguns

    You would probably want to swap the pad on the Boyds unit for a Decelerator or similar.
    Their thumbholes are in stock, and I have one on a Savage 93. If you have a gun store near you I'd look at one of those, as they are Boyd's stocks. You can then get an idea what those stocks are like, especially for hand sizing.
    My two young girls have shot my 93 in 22LR and not had any problems, FYI.

    For the scopes I own two Nikon Monarch 5-20x44 scopes in addition to the Vortexes I linked. I find the Vortex to have a larger field of view when comparing them side-by-side, and a much larger eyebox. It is much more comfortable to use. The Vortex is my preference, no contest.
     
  8. SDBoltz

    SDBoltz Member

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    I think he was asking if he should just wait and save for a composite or go with the cheaper laminate now. I've seen laminates crack over time, not the stock but the finish. And they can be hit or miss on being a "drop in" - I'd get a composite. It's not like the factory stock is broken or anything. Just shoot it until you can get the HS.
     
  9. accubonded

    accubonded Member

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    I'd agree with liltank about the scopes. I love my vortex viper. And a thought on the stocks I picked up a choate ultimate varmint stock. It's a bit heavy but your son in a strong young man and should have no trouble with it. Also it has multiple adjustments to give a custom fit. I'm 6ft and 185 lbs and have no trouble with the weight at all even with quick shots
     
  10. SBD

    SBD Member

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    Yeah SDBoltz that's exactly right -

    liltank we'd LOVE a HS stock, it's just the laminate is within the budget and the HS is something we'd have to wait on. But a composite would absolutely be a 1st choice, whether its a HS or not. Actually we are leaning towards the composite. He likes the thumbhole. He has been shooting my AR of a bipod, its pretty close in angle. Is there someone who makes a full aluminum bedding block like in a composite, that is designed to be used with a laminate stock? In lieu of just pillars.
     
  11. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    There is a company called Stockade Stocks. He mainly specializes in stocks for Savages, but he can inlet for Rem. 700 actions. He offers a money saver stock that gives you a fully aluminum bedded composite stock. It's a drop in too. All you would have to do is some sanding, skim coating to fill some minor pin hole in the epoxy coating and paint. They are very nice stocks and offer several different models. That might be a way to go. Here's the website:

    Stocks

    Looks like there may be an extra charge for Remingtons, but you could call and talk numbers with Kevin Rayhill. He is the owner of the company. Choates are a very good money saving option. There new Tactical stock has gotten some good reviews. Might want to look into that.

    Here is another option. You can stiffen up the stock that comes with the rifle. You could get it bedded in Devcon or Marinetex, and have some arrow shafts or steel rods bedded in the forearm. That will stiffen it up considerably and will cost nothing more than materials and your time. Just a thought.

    Tank
     
  12. SBD

    SBD Member

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    Ok great. We will check out both Stockade and Choate, the latter I'm am somewhat familiar with. Thanks for the options. As far as bedding the factory stock, do you know how well that works? The few smiths I've contacted won't bed those stocks. I guess the plastic does not take well to the material and works itself loose. Thoughts? At anyrate we'll keep our option open and see what we end up with. Thanks again
     
  13. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    I have never bedded the ADL synthetic, so I'm no help there. Somebody here might have a better answer. Hope all works out for ya.
     
  14. feelinducky

    feelinducky Well-Known Member

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    I have 2 laminates from Stockys. 1 Hart with the alum bedding block. My rem 700 dropped right in without any fitting.. I had it skim bedded and it shoots consistent. The second laminate I purchased from stockys is the Herritage classic sport and it looks great. I decided to go from ADL to bdl with this one. It's not installed yet but I did a dry run with it and it fits right in. I have a wood Remington ADL stock if your interested in that send me a pm.