Berger lowers B.C.s

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Topshot, Jun 13, 2009.

  1. Topshot

    Topshot Well-Known Member

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    I see on the Berger web site that most if not all B.C.s for their projectiles have been changed.

    With these changes and other changes made by other manufacturers with the introduction of new bullets etc, my Nightforce Exbal program is rapidly getting out of date with regards to its bullet B.C. reference files.

    I only bought the latest copy 8 months ago and it is already way out of date!

    Anyone know how I can edit or update these files without having to purchase a new version of the program?

    I know I can do manual inputs but I would still like to keep the bullet B.C. reference file up to date.
     
  2. dirtball

    dirtball Well-Known Member

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  3. Ridge Runner

    Ridge Runner Well-Known Member

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    Don't see where it makes a whole lot of difference, its just a starting point anyway. Of all the bullets I've shot in the last 7-8 years the only bullet that the published BC was spot on to what I was shooting was a lapua 139 gr scenar. Every other one that I've worked with I had to change the BC to make my charts match my actual trajectory. a couple examples

    Nosler 160 accubond published BC is .531, I'm running .62 in exbal to make my chart match my trajectory to 1200+ yards.

    Berger 140 gr vld, box says BC.64, I'm running it at .7 have shot it to 1060 and POI matches POA.

    Using the same methods the 139 scenars were spot on with the published BC of .615 out to 1100 yards.
    RR
     
  4. Topshot

    Topshot Well-Known Member

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    I know that they have not changed their bullets! But the fact remains that they have updated their advertised B.C.'s and they are now significantly different to what is listed in my Exbal program.

    It is the Exbal program that I am interested in and how to update the database files without buying a whole new software package.

    If I am giong to use this software to compare bullets from different manufacturers, then I would like to compare the most up to date information possible.
     
  5. phorwath

    phorwath Well-Known Member

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    If you're tired of paying for sofware updates then purchase Patagonia Ballistics LoadBase software. Updates, and even some upgrades are free. They (PB) updated their Berger BCs quite some time ago.
     
  6. Mikecr

    Mikecr Well-Known Member

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    Why do you think you need to change BCs anway? I mean, for all we know, Berger may have departed from a standard our particular software relies on.
     
  7. Topshot

    Topshot Well-Known Member

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    Aparently a ballistician by the name of Bill Davis came up with the original B.C.s for Berger bullets but recently a bloke by the name of Bryan Litz did some field tests and measured the actual B.C.s of berger bullets and found them to be consistently 3% to 5% high.

    Berger has correctly republished these more accurate B.C. figures to better represent the true flight path of their bullets. This is a good thing!

    It still leaves me with my Exbal problem. Maybe I should take phorwath's advice and invest in some software from Patagonia Ballistics? :cool:
     
  8. JeffVN

    JeffVN Well-Known Member

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    I ran into a similar problem but in the opposite direction (exbal was telling me I needed more wind and elevation than I was seeing on the range) I went into the exbal program and modified the bc component to ta proper number, then saved the profile in my pda as a specific load.

    Jeffvn
     
  9. Mikecr

    Mikecr Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it's the way to go, I don't know.
    When using G1 BC for bullets that are closer to G7, theres only going to be 1 or 2 ranges that are dead on anyway. If dead on at 700, they'll likely hit a bit high closer, and low further out.
    So it seems like Bryan is averaging for what he believes will produce best overall results.
    Kind of like defining 'point blank range' with a tolerance(kill zone).

    I just don't think this is accounted for in ALL software though. For my use, Exbal, QuickTarget, and Pejsa have worked well with Berger's old numbers and my muzzle velocities.
    I'm thinking the retarding terms used in common software already reduce effective BC with falling velocity at each range iteration. Or the software allows G7 retarding, and you wouldn't want to base that on low-averaged G1BC.
    Guess I'll need to do specific testing to find out which works better.
    I have alot to learn anyway.
     
  10. Topshot

    Topshot Well-Known Member

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    OK Boy's,

    I got some feed back from Nightforce. The following is an extract from an Email sent to me by them.

    > You can download updates at anytime from:
    >
    > www.perry-systems.com
    >
    > The updates do cost 17.00 USD and I update my software about once
    every
    > year.
    >


    Good one Nightforce, problem solved!!!:)
     
  11. Eric Stecker

    Eric Stecker <b>SPONSOR</b>

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    Just a heads up that you can go to our website to also get G7 BCs for those bullets to which it applies. They are listed on our products page and on a Quick Reference Sheet that can be found on this forum and on our website (several links in many locations).

    Also, Bryan wrote an article you can read on our web log that gives an explaination as to why we are including the G7 BC for our bullets.

    If you want to get some more detailed information about our BCs contact Bryan directly at bryan.litz@bergerbullets.com.

    Regards,
    Eric