AR-15 with 1/12 twist barrel

Discussion in 'AR15/10 Rifles' started by texasdave, Sep 4, 2011.

  1. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    I am looking for info on what bullet weight and powder to use with the 1/12 twist barrel. I have read that the XM193 military ammo was what should be used. I just got this rifle and wanted to find out whats best. All information is greatly appreciated. I am thinking H335 and a 55gn bullet.
    Thanks
    Dave
     
  2. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    Any 40 gr up to 63 gr should work. It should shoot very well with a 50 or 55 Vmax. 335 or 748 powder should provide good results.
     

  3. Denny2277

    Denny2277 Well-Known Member

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    I have loaded up to 64gr Winchester Power Points with a single shot Rossi. It had a 1:12. I used 25 grains of H335 to get about a 1 1/2 inch group. Hope this helps.
     
  4. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Thanks very much. Does anyone know why the 5.56 xm855 would not work? I read that the military manual says not to use except in emergency combat situations. To use the xm193. Just curious as to why.
    Thanks
    Dave
     
  5. Kevin Thomas

    Kevin Thomas Well-Known Member

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    Texasdave,

    The M193 isn't what you should use, it's just what the military did use as standard ball ammo for the M16 and M16A1 rifles. Lots of much better options out there, and almost all will beat the pants off the M193 in terms of accuracy. Most of the FMJ Ball stuff is about 2-3 MOA, or a bit better if it's a real good lot. Crappy stuff, but suitable for combat accuracy.

    The M855 is the longer 62 grain bullet, same as the SS109 NATO round, and needs a significantly faster twist to be properly stabilized. Out of your rifle, they'd tumble, keyhole and give horrible accuracy. Not dangerous to you or the gun, just won't be able to hit anything with these.

    Long450 gave you some good advice here, both in terms of bullet weight and powder choices. Try H335, H332, 748, N133 or N135 with bullets in the 45-60 grain range, and you'll get your best accuracy and decent velocity. Need the slower powders like RL-15, Varget of N140 when you get to the heavier bullets (69-82 grains), but your twist makes these a non-issue. Stick to the faster powders and you're good to go.
     
  6. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Kevin;
    I really appreciate your advice. I was looking at Hornady's reloading manual and they used a 1/12 twist barrel in their 223 Remington testing. Which brings me to ask what do you think about BL-C2 powder?
    Thanks
    Dave
     
  7. Kevin Thomas

    Kevin Thomas Well-Known Member

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    A good powder, but not my favorite for this cartridge. Works, but I think there's several better choices, including others in the Hodgdon line. H322, H335 or even BenchMark are all good if you want to stick with Hodgdon. The H322 is particularly good for both velocity and accuracy with mid-weight bullets in this caliber.
     
  8. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Kevin:
    Ok Ill rise to the bait. LOL what would be your favorite powder ? I have just been going by whats in the reloading manuals and not shot any on the range myself yet. 748 looks good also IMR 3031 maybe>
    Dave
     
  9. Kevin Thomas

    Kevin Thomas Well-Known Member

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    Hey Dave,

    No real favorite powder here, just a range of them which suit a particular job. For my own shooting, the vast majority of what I do in 223 is competitive; 77s and 82 grain bullets for HighPower across the course matches. There, I've used Varget for years now. The other big favorite is RL-15, and it'll cover exactly the same range of uses that Varget will. Also started using N135 and N140 in recent years, and having very good results with them as well.

    In the lighter weight (mid range, 50-60 grain) bullets, run the powders I mentioned earlier. They'll serve you well, for both accuracy and velocity.

    Again, can't really say there's a favorite powder, but there are some I avoid if I can. The IMR 3031 is one of them. Good powder, and capable of very good accuracy (Remington used to use it for their 308 Win accuracy test loads in the Custom Shop for testing 40-Xs), but it's a bitch to run through a measure. Bridges very badly and you're crunching powder on every stroke. If you're weighing it it's no worse than any other powder, but it's not powder measure friendly. The 748 (and any other ball powder, for that matter) goes through a measure like water. Doesn't necessarily produce better loads, but it is easier to get along with at the reloading bench.
     
  10. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Kevin:
    I really appreciate your help. I have about desided that maybe 748 would be the way to go. I am always looking for the most speed and accuracy I can get. But the AR15 is not the same as say a 30/338 Lapua or 300 Ultra.
    Thanks
    Dave
     
  11. Kevin Thomas

    Kevin Thomas Well-Known Member

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    Dave,

    No, it certainly isn't. For one thing, they're generally found only in bolt guns, and the AR's a whole different animal. Hate to beat a dead horse here, but this is my usual rant about loading for ARs, or other semi-autos. It's an example of advanced handloading, and needs to be treated entirely differently than does bolt gun reloading. Use gages to determine your sizing, full length resize ALWAYS, and you may even want to go to small base dies if there's any hint of chambering issues.

    Better than my running all this down again, check out Glen Zediker's "Handloading for Competition". There's also a section on reloading for gas guns in the Sierra manual, and it's pinned on www.usrifleteams.com under their reloading forum. The Precision Shooting Reloading Guide (not a relaoding manual) has a chapter by John Feamster on Service Rifle reloading that's worth its weight in gold. If you're new to gas guns, check these sources out. They're worth the time, and could save you some trouble. In the meantime, any other questions, just post 'em right here!
     
  12. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Kevin:
    The suggestions sound great and thats something I will check out. Againj I really appreciate all your help.
    Dave
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2011
  13. Kevin Thomas

    Kevin Thomas Well-Known Member

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    Anytime!
     
  14. rdsii64

    rdsii64 Well-Known Member

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    if your rifle has a 12 twist and I had to shoot it, I would load either the 53 grain Vmax or the 55 grain ballistic tip over 25.5 grains of N150. If I don't need killing power I would load the 52 grain amax for pure accuracy.

    EDIT:

    I ment N133
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2011