6.5/300WSM and giving "props"

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by *WyoWhisper*, Sep 25, 2003.

  1. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    Well I figure that given the "hessitant acceptance" on other boards we need to give credit where credit is due when "one of our own" deserves it...

    I met Chris Matthews through this board and after several e-mails and some question and answer sessions.. (He even called ME to discuss several things.) I decided to have him build a rifle for me. I had a Win. LA and thought .. Well, I've wanted to try a 6.5/300WSM so why not...
    Going into this venture with Chris, he patiently answered my numerous and annoying e-mails ( DC you know how I can get) if I wasn't asking one thing about this, I was asking another about that...
    We knew going in that this was a guinea pig project and not sure how this fairly new wildcat cartridge/project would turn out...
    Chris took care of all the calls to Redding for dies etc. I feel there isn't anything he wouldn't have done to make this project work. I can't say enough about his professionalism, patience, craftmanship and promptness!!

    Ok to the particulars...

    Win Mod. 70 LA Blue Printed etc. Mike Rock #6 fluted 28" 8 twist barrel, Holland quick discharge break. HS Stock, Tuned stock win trigger, Badger ordinance base and rings and she wears a 8.5-25 LR lupy...

    After numerous powders and a few kinds of bullets.. ( afterall there isn't much data out there.. ) and another flurry of e-mails to Chris, I found a powder/bullet combo or 2 that works....

    I'm using RL 25 and Berger 140 VLD's and I also had some good results with H4831SC...

    I am going to try 142 SMK's again as well as Lapua Scenars...


    anyway.. my point is that working with Chris Matthews was more than a pleasant enjoyable experience. TOP quality craftsmanship and good to his word! I have send 2 rifles to him and another will be on its way next week and we are making plans to build another..

    OK for results... a picture is worth a 1000 words right.....

    6.5/300 WSM
    [​IMG]

    The group..5 shots, RL25, Berger 140VLD, 3100 FPS...

    [​IMG]

    [ 09-25-2003: Message edited by: *WyoWhisper* ]
     
  2. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Looks good-- I've already decided to do my MRC action in 6.5 WSM when it arrives next month--looks like you just save me alot of work...Thanks....
     

  3. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    When ya get it shoot me an e-mail... got lotsa data.... [​IMG]
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I'll be giving Chris and George a call as soon as the action arrives.. I'll let you know when I get it together...
     
  5. DANTEC

    DANTEC Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    390
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2002
    just a question

    6.5/300 WSM is in the water capacity class of the 264 WIN mag , in a 264 WIN mag than not really difficult to get 3200 fps with a 140 gr in a 28 inch so why not use more the potential of the 6.5/300 WSM to reach highter velocity

    good shooting

    DAN TEC
     
  6. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    Dan,


    I ran 142 SMK's outta it at 3400 safely... but 2900 - 3100 seems to be where the 140 gr "ish" bullets like to be....

    My most accurate load was at 3100 fps... so that where I'll keep her until I can do more testing....

    I have 1000 ft. lbs. at 1000 yards at 3100 fps....
     
  7. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Ric,

    Glad to see another 6.5wsm. Yours is shooting better than my dads if you can get those tight of groups consistantly! He was messing around with his loads above 3150 fps, until I told him what Ken Markle was telling me about bullet base deformation.

    Ken said that once you get to the 3150 fps mark with most 6.5 bullets, the base will deform from the pressure and thus cause the lead to push forward and deform the ogive... large inaccuracies are a direct result. This was tested and verified in the bullet forming dies as to what level of pressure deformed the bullets bases.

    He's loading to levels under 3100 now, we'll see how she shoots down lower for a change.

    He's using RL25 and had the best luck with it too. It's the best at filling the case up and unless I had to, I wouldn't pursue 4831 for lack of density. The lower the charge density, the farther peak pressure is moved toward the muzzle and bullet upset gets worse. I'd use the regular 4831 to better fill the case if having to use it, the SC has a lower bulk density and will just make it worse when trying to fill up the case better, even tho it does meter smoother.

    The 140 Bergers, and 142 SMK's shoot the best in his 6.5wsm, with the nod going to the SMK.

    Did you use the 270wsm or the 300wsm length case, or the longer 7mm case to base it off of? Dad uses 270wsm brass for his.

    Wow, that's a nice small group!

    What load are you getting 3100 with RL25, and what's your OAL with the Berger too.

    We were getting 3130 fps with the Berger load and RL25 we originally started working up from, and psi was 55,000 psi on the Oehler 43 with 66.0gr at 3.1 OAL. Are you running the Bergers into the lands?


    We got up to 68gr and fired 3 rounds there, pressure was 58,900 on the first shot but rose up and was 67,800 by the last shot, 3200 on up to 3300 fps. Toward the higher end on a few loads, we saw this trend of rapidly climbing MV and psi. It never has been present when backed off a grain or two tho. His has a 30" tube.
     
  8. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    Brent,


    Well Holy Crap!!! I never knew the 6.5's can deform at higher pressures... that makes a whole lot of sense, at speeds greater than 3150 or so I will put 3 on top of one another then another 2" away then another about an inch away then another right back into the group.. it DROVE me nuts....

    I think I will actually settle on about 3050 to be safe for the changes in weather conditions...
    Thanks for the insight....

    I love the Extreme powders by Hogdon but I have had the best results with RL... I am going to work alot with Retumbo and see what happens....

    [ 09-25-2003: Message edited by: *WyoWhisper* ]
     
  9. SteveE

    SteveE Member

    Messages:
    16
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2002
    How would this compare to the 6.5/284 or the 6.5/06? I might have to rebuild my 6/284 short action to either the 6.284 or wsm.

    [ 09-25-2003: Message edited by: SteveE ]
     
  10. chris matthews

    chris matthews Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    838
    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    First let me say thanks to Ric for the kind words.
    Second, I wouldn't suggest this as a short action cartridge if you want a repeater. Bullets are way too long for seating at SA mag lengths. I build most of the 6.5-284 on long actions also for the same reason.

    Chris
     
  11. SteveE

    SteveE Member

    Messages:
    16
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2002
    I forgot to add, my short action has been turned into a single shot, so it has no magazine. The only problem I might have is ejecting a loaded case. But that is no big deal, my 338/378 is the same way. So which would be better, 6.5/284 or 6.5/300wsm?
    thanks
     
  12. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    Steve,

    Well... seeing as my experience with the 6.5/284 you get the best results with bullets at about 2700-2900 fps give or take. It is hard to get to 3000 with out using a 30" barrel.. I could be wrong but I had a 6.5/284 and you had to really fill the case and use every inch of the 30" tube...
    The 6.5/300 easily gets to 3000 fps with a med load.. your biggest concern ( now that I understand it ) is bullets not deforming.. I am going to try Lapua Scenars and see how they work.. I tried some sierra 140 SMK's and they couldn't handle anything over 3100 either...
    I can't complain with 3100 fps and bergers they give me 966 ft. lbs at 1000 yards... If the Lapua's work they will yeild 925 ft. lbs at 1000 yards.

    I still think the answer to this is the 155 SMK's but I don't want to buy 500 of them ... I will split 500 with someone if they want to go halves with me...!! Just e-mail me....
     
  13. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
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    Jun 12, 2001
    Ric,

    Wondered if you might have missed a couple of questions I'd asked in the previous post?

    Dad has a 9 twist in his, he'd be trying the 155 SMK if it was a faster twist. Steve Shelp had used them and said the 142 SMK bullets had much better consistancy at the time and no one was really using the 155 for that reason.

    I have some intersting data I'll send you that my smith up here collected, let me know what you think of it. It was basically the same case, just a 300 Ultra Mag shortened to the length of the WSM in 6.5mm. He cut the barrel off an inch at a time etc recording the effects with several powders during the testing. Interesting...
    I'll email it to you.
     
  14. *WyoWhisper*

    *WyoWhisper* Guest

    Brent,

    Yup.. e-amil it to me... I'd be real interested...
    I'm using 270WSM brass
    58 grs of RL 25
    measured to the ogive 2.394
    COL is 3.060 to the tip of the bullets

    Case is trimmed to SAMMI min. specs

    I seat the bergers to touch.. that is always where I have had best results in various rifle....
    Thanks in advance for that data!!!