6.5-06 Ackley or the 264 Win Mag

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by RyanG, Dec 29, 2012.

  1. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    Good morning all.

    I am in the process of putting together a rifle that I wanna use for Antelope hunting and maybe deer once in a while. I have it narrowed down to the 6.5 bullet. I am leaning towards the 264 Win Mag mostly for nostalgia. I like the idea of the 6.5-06 Aky but I have no idea where to get reloading dies, headspace gauges, etc....

    Any help would be great....

    Thanks
     

  2. Trnelson

    Trnelson Well-Known Member

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    I have a 6.5-06 "standard" built on a savage action that I've pretty well shot out. It shot the 140 Berger VLD hunting bullet right at 3000fps with a stiff load of R-25 1/2 MOA for about 1,000 rounds and has deteriorated to a 1 MOA tube :( I was considering going to the AI chambered 06 in the new barrel, but have decided to give a 28" 264 win mag a try this time just to try something a little different this time. Dies aren't too difficult to get for the 6.5-06AI just a quick google search should settle that issue same for the headspace gauges. I don't think either choice is a poor one. Just be sure that you get at least an 8 twist so you can take full advantage of the high BC 140g class bullets. IMO look to a 28" barrel to get full velocity out of either chambering. In the end, pick the one you like that best fits your circumstances and enjoy it. As a hunting rifle it should last a lifetime as a "target" gun a 1,000 rounds is about the end of it. Stainless barrels are supposedly good for a little more than 1,500. I shall see...
     

  3. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    Thank you so much for getting back to me on this. I am still on the fence on which one to go with. I love the idea of the speed for the 264.... also getting dies is really easy so is converting 7mm mag brass.... but the 06AI might just have the same speed.... or close...

    I am working on a Savage action as well. If I go the 06 route I wont have to change the bolt face which is back ordered EVERYWHERE!

    Its funny one morning I wake up and have my mind made up and its the 264.... then by dinner I can find more than one reason to go to the 06! lol
     
  4. Trnelson

    Trnelson Well-Known Member

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    I "think" the 06AI is capable of getting pretty darn close to the 264 win in velocity. Case life may be the drawback of the 06AI if you drive it hard. I get four loads out of my 6.5/06 before primer pockets get a bit loose and I pitch the brass. I have the magnum bolt head on back order myself currently...
     
  5. ol mike

    ol mike Well-Known Member

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    The 264 has always been a cartridge I've wanted to build a rifle around.
    What's not to like .
    Mike
     
  6. loaders_loft

    loaders_loft Well-Known Member

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    I chose the 6.5-06 built by jerry at newman precision in elk city oklahoma. we built it with a 8.5 twist brux #3 at 26" on a donor 700 long action. Lots of guys are using this twist for 260's so why not this cartridge too. Anyway I had no intention of shooting the berger 140. My load is a130 scirrocco at 3090 fps with n560. That is right on the heels of the 264 and alot less powder. nosler sells their 264 ammunition with the 130 accubond rated at 3100 fps so there you go.

    Jerry already has the reamer... Just sayin'
     
  7. jakelly

    jakelly Well-Known Member

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    I have owned the 6.5-06, 264, and the 6.5-06 AI (current rifle). With a 26 inch barrel I think the speed of the 264 and AI will be within 50 fps, but all three will be very close.

    Stretching: AI>264>06
    Ease of brass prep: 06>264>AI
    Ease of accurate loading: AI>=06>264
    Light Recoil: 06>AI>264
    Consistent velocity: AI=06>264
    Reloading dies: 264>06>AI

    This is not perfect data, I understand the short comings of my anecdotal evidence, but I think you will find similar results. The 06 case is near perfect for this bore size and inherently very accurate, the same can't be said for the 264. I choose the AI because of the case design and long range performance. YRMV, but there aren't many 264 target guns out there. Talk to owners of all three and see how that 264 compares to the 06s.
     
  8. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    I have never had a wildcat round. Man I like the results of the 06AI but I just cant find any reloading info on it or dies to reload them. I did see that ER Shaw sells a 06AI barrel that I can get in a 1/8, I do want to shoot 140's. I wouldnt have to change out the bolt heat, which is a plus. And I am really leaning that way. BUT no one here that I know of shoots either. I did find a sight that listed 06 wildcat dies but you had to know the shoulder angle. I am assuming that a standard AI shoulder is 40 Degrees. Is this correct?

    Im getting to crunch time because I am going to order my barrel and trigger stuff this week. Shit or get off the pot my dad use to say.....

    Im not sure that I am gonna load them real hot. I do want to shoot the 140's tho. That is just such a great bullet for deer and such. Has been fun doing all the research tho:D
     
  9. loaders_loft

    loaders_loft Well-Known Member

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    I think you can (carefully) go 1-2 grains above the max data in the nosler book for 6.5-06 if using the 6.5-06 AI. Velocity may be slightly higher but not as much as you might expect. I found slightly less velocity in my 6.5-06 than the nosler book claimed for N560 but didn't verify with any other powders. That was interesting to me because the test barrel was 24" and I have a 26".

    You can get the dies from redding.
     
  10. benchracer

    benchracer Well-Known Member

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    If you are going to go the 6.5-06AI route, I would recommend sending a pm to forum member elkaholic. He had a reamer made for a variant of the 6.5-06AI that he calls the 6.5 Sherman. He has had pretty spectacular results with that cartridge. If you are going to go to the trouble of doing the AI, you might as well go all the way.

    While the 6.5-06 and its variants certainly have a significant efficiency advantage over the .264WM, I don't believe there are any other advantages. I have seen claims that the .264WM isn't as inherently accurate as some of the other 6.5's, but that has not been my experience so far.

    From the same rifle, with the same barrel quality, and with the same care in handloading, I don't think there is a detectable difference. I have a 6.5x55 with a Shilen barrel, a 6.5-284 with a Krieger barrel, and a factory Winchester model 70 in .264WM.

    The factory Winchester is shooting right with the other two in terms of accuracy (although I haven't shot VLD type bullets in it yet). The only difference from one to the other is speed and a little bit of recoil. All three rifles are shooting 140g bullets into under .5" three shot groups @ 100 yards.

    One advantage of the .264WM over the 6.5-06AI route is simplicity. Buy a standard 3-die set and either Winchester or Nosler Custom brass and you are in business. No special dies and no fire forming needed.

    As a 6.5 addict, I don't believe you can go wrong with any of the 6.5's. Finding the right one for you is simply a matter of matching your desired performance level and loading characteristics with a given cartridge.
     
  11. Trickymissfit

    Trickymissfit Well-Known Member

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    most all modern loading manuals have the 6.5-06 in it already, and that's where you start out at. Fire forming cases is easy with that round as all you do is load standard 6.5-06 rounds with a good heavy load.

    Actually there are several 6.5-06 improved rounds out there. They have shoulder angle from 28 degrees to 40 degrees and slightly different body tapers. There are several that are simply .257AI cases necked up to .264, and there are even some that use the 06 case shortened slightly. Also don't forget the 6.5/284
    gary
     
  12. RyanG

    RyanG Well-Known Member

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    Well so far this morning I have changed my mind at least 3 different times! lol..... I was able to find some 06AI dies on Midway by RCBS..... a bit pricey but it all comes out in the wash right? They are on back order until at least May. But that is going to be ok because it will probably take that long to get the barrel. Shilen doesnt make a 6.5-06AI Barrel. I also want to go 28" for what ever cal. I go with. So any recommendations on barrel brand would help too. I do like the simplicity of the 264..... So I guess my mind will change back and forth for at least another 100 times before Wed when I finally order the stuff. :rolleyes:

    I already have a 6.5-284 it was done on a Remington 700 Long action all blue printed and trued with a 28" Shilen barrel. Its a bit heavy but Im getting 3000 fps from a 140 grain VLD. If I was smart I would just build another one with a lighter barrel and use if for my hunting rifle.... but what is the fun in having 2 of the same when there others that I dont have YET? :D

    I am hooked on the 6.5 family as well.
     
  13. Bob L.

    Bob L. Well-Known Member

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    I just had a 264wm built for my dad, Trued Rem Long action with Lilja #3 9 twist barrel at 27". I love it. Just bedded it in an old wood adl stock and dad shot a .375" 3 shot group at 100 yards with cheap factory Winchester 140 grain soft points. Components are not an issue for the 264wm either.
    I will be working a load up with the Barnes 127 LRX bullet, should be able to push them fast.

    I do not see the point of going 6.5-06AI, but no offense just my opinion.

    I think you would like a 264wm.
     
  14. tulku

    tulku Well-Known Member

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    RG , I picked up an AI from a 1000 yard Benchrester . It Chronos 3150 FPS with the 140 grain Sierras and has a 30 inch Barrel . Redding has Dies . One other factor which may mean something to you is that you can pick from a huge field of Brass ..... 30-06 Lapua , Norma , IMI or the German Brand I can't think of right now , as well as all sorts of 25-06 Brass too . Hey , half the fun is in the planning ....... then the work starts .