SOLD/EXPIRED 300 WM vs 300 wsm

[lloydsmale]

explain to me how the wsm can be loaded to a higher pressure then the 300 win can be loaded too. Pressure is pressure and a gun doesnt know if its a win mag or a wsm. Cross section a wsm case and your find its not a bit stronger then a 300 win mag case. Its not built for higer pressure its just loaded to a higher pressure. Something they had to do to get there inflated ballistics. I ask you to show me one example of two rounds the same caliber with less powder capasity that if loaded to the same pressure will be faster. An o6 will allways beat a 308 and a 300 mag will allways beat an 06 and the same can be said for the 300 win and the wsm. Like i said ive got nothing against the wsm. Ive even shot a number of deer with it but If you cut through all the bs and the phony advertising it has the same case capasity as the 300 H&H and because of it the same ballistics. that is unless you want to run pressures just short of blowing primers out of the case. Ive been handloading for 40 years and have been loading various 300 mags for at least 30 of those and one thing ive come to believe is my chronograph doesnt lie. Ammo makers and gun manufactures lie. Believe what you want. QUOTE=BountyHunter;643628]Case capacity does not always mean more speed. Efficiancy will win too, and that is where the WSM is.

As for same pressures, DUH, the WSM is built for higher pressures while the Win Mag is not, so totally bogus arguement. The WSM can be taken to higher pressures yet over the Win Mag so Win Mag can never win equal speed arguement due to the pressure differences.

Not about reading it somewhere also. Been shooting the WSM since it came out and built probably the first comp gun with it, so 10 years of experience with it AND the Win Mag, 6 WSM guns and numerous barrels I have a real good handle on what is and isn't with both.[/QUOTE]

 

[dherrin]

Good info

 

[sp6x6]

Somebody should move to the right section. I would like to see more inputs,relating to pressure

 

[Augustus011]

I will move my next and probably controversal question on this topic to the right section. Thank you very much for your info so far has been good.

 

[Broz]

As for me and my house, we will shoot the .300WinMag. johnnyk

Same here. I will admit my experience with the 300 wsm is limited. But my experience with the 300 Win. is pretty extensive with many many different rifles. I own 3 long range 300 win's right now and my son also has one.

With my limited experience with the 300 wsm I saw less velocity with 210 Bergers. Plus I was fighting to get them seated where they needed to be and still fit in the mag box and cycle. I can take a 700 rem in 300 win and load them to the lands and put them in a std magnum mag box and they will cycle.

My custom defiance 300 win with a Broughton 28" 5C is sending the 210 Berger @ 2995 fps @ 4100 ft. This is over an Oehler 35 with confirmed drops to well past 1000 yards. The rifle is a SOLID 1/2 moa gun to 1000 off a bipod.

Does anyone have a 300 WSM that will send 210gr bullets close to 3000 fps? If so I would like to hear your load and elevation. I have read many places the 300 wsm is slower than the 300 win. But it seems in this thread some say different. I would like to hear first hand from a shooter that is using both. If not I will simply rely on my own field results and forget the stuff you read that is many times simply owner pride in caliber.

Jeff

 

[peashooter]

I shot 210 SMK @ 2850 from a 26" barrel 300 WSM. I really did not want to push it any harder.

 

[BountyHunter]

three of us have shot the WSM with 210s at 2950-3025 in competition. All used 30" barrels, custom throats and MRP powder (all same lot) with Norma brass and F210s.

However, I have to say the majority shoot the 210s at 2850-2875 as their sweet spot.

All three guns were winners also routinely.

IMO, the MRP powder has proven to be a real sleeper with the WSM.

BTW, those are pretty much the same nodes that the Win Mag shoots best in also.

The big difference is no belt, short fat efficiant case that lasts long time and 2-3x the barrel life with the WSM. Makes it just hard to beat.

Very seldom see a Win Mag now compared to the WSM. The WSM is just that much better/easier to make shoot accurately.

As for the WSM being slower, just look at the Winchester published ballistics of the WSM and Win Mag. In most cases the WSM pushes the same bullet equal to if not faster. Yes at 3000 PSI potential higher pressure, but that is why they designed that case and why the Win Mag was designed over the 300 H&H. So any arguement that "if you load them to the same pressure" is total BS. I can make that same arguement with the 300 H&H on why it is as good as the Win Mag, but no one would believe it either.

 

[lloydsmale]

and ill ask why not load the 300 win up to the same pressures? I dont see guys shooting the 257 roberts or the 7mauser at factory levels. Ive been at this for about 40 years and the load data for about all the rifle rounds and especially the magnums has been downloaded alot in the loading manuals. Biggest differnce i see is with the short mags the data given is about equal in pressure to what they used to load the longer mags too. A rifle is a rifle. A 300 win mag model 70 is not weaker then a 300wsm 70 is. Both rifles are completely capable of running the same pressures. The brass is surely just as strong too. I dont think to many here use factory ammo so it sure isnt an arguement that because factory 300 win is milder its not an arguement to say that loading both up to there true potential isnt a fair comparison. Its no differnt then saying a 757 can be loaded to equal or better a 708. the 708 is shorter and was designed by the factory to run higher pressures too but in equal strenght guns theres not a single reason the 757 cant be loaded to the same pressure. The short mags are toted as giving the same velocitys as standard mags because of there effiecentcy and i wont argue that grain for grain of powder they will produce more velocity the a bigger case will but a couple grains more of powder is a pretty small expense and ill stand behind the my belief that in the same gun at the same pressures the short mags wont produce as much velocity

As to case life id about bet that if you headspace on the shoulder instead of on the belt a win mag case will last as long as a wsm case. Being belted or beltless doesnt mean much as the belt is more of a decoration then anything. Barrel life i cant argue much. The 300 win is using more powder so i guess it may burn a barrel out faster but i have to wonder what the comparison would be like if you were running both at factory pressure levels as most higher pressure loadings tend to burn out throats faster. Especially when using ball powders. I guess for the most part we will have to agree to disagree. Personaly i think the short mags were an answer to a question that didnt exist. Like I said i have nothing against the 300wsm. If a great deal came up on one i might even buy one but i surely am not buying one figurig its going to do a pinch of *** more then my 300 win mags allready do. I guess we have to keep in mind what were using them for. Im not trying to punch tiny groups at a 1000 yards with my 30 mags. there hunting guns pure and simple. I dont even fool with bullets heavier then 180s even in my 300 wby mag. For your use the extra velocity really doesnt matter as your loading for the ultimate in accuracy not power.

 

[heavy hitting 300]

well i better get my 2 cents in haha

i personally shoot a 300 ultra but my uncle has a 300 wsm he loves and i got him to try and push heavy bullets out of it and it just didnt have the case capasity to power the big bullets out at speed.

i have a friend that shoots an old 300 wm in the old blued barrel sendero with more rounds down it then id like to think about. it shoots great and is a super accurate gun.

really it comes down to what your gonna want to do with it and if you need or just want the extra longer case. personal prefrence.

some shoot wsm some shoot wm i shoot ULTRA MAG gun)