243 Ackley Improved Problems

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by AL Winters, Mar 24, 2013.

  1. AL Winters

    AL Winters New Member

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    Can anyone suggest a supplier for 243 Ackley Improved brass. The rifle I have will not permit closing the bolt on a factory 243 Winchester cartridge so I cannot fire form from factory ammo. It will also not permit bolt clousure with an empty 243 Lapua case. A friend told me I would have to turn the cases down inorder to load and chamber a regular 243 Win Lapua cartridge prior to fire forming. Can someone tell me where I can get brass already formed or help me with this issue on turning cases. Thanks Al.
     
  2. sixtwoeightyfour

    sixtwoeightyfour Member

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    When you say it Wont close, will it close but with some resistence? If this is the case and the chamber isnt a tight neck this is normal. With Improved cartridges there is always some resistence when chambering unformed brass, this is providing your headspace until fireformed. If it closes with some force look at the brass and you should see a ring at the neck shoulder junction and it should chamber easier if you try it again. There are other issues like neck diameter that it could be but I would make sure that this doesnt work first. If it doesnt work, Then you would have to find out if you need to neck turn your brass or trim to fit.
    I dont know of any formed brass and it really wouldnt help you anyway.
    BTW: If the bolt closed easily in the chamber with a standard .243 you would have more to worry about.
     

  3. AL Winters

    AL Winters New Member

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    Thanks for the reply--The bolt will not close on a loaded Remington round or unloaded Lapua 243 Win cartridge. The action is a Remington 700SA and I cannot quite the the bolt closed enough to cam over.
     
  4. TOM H

    TOM H Well-Known Member

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    Not sure what you mean by turning down cases. You should be able to chamber 243 loaded or unloaded case if headspace it done right at least mine does than. the 243 case is smaller than 243AI you blow the shoulder forward for the 243AI and increase body dia start of shoulders and mine has same neck length as 243. I fired formed both Win and Lapua brass and if it was me I'd get hold of who chamber that rifle or get hold of a good gunsmith find out what the problem is.
     
  5. Sully2

    Sully2 Well-Known Member

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    I dont own a modified 243....but thats identical to my 25-06AI. I can fire standard 25-06 rounds ( and mighty dammed accurate too I might add) which is what I have to do to fire form my brass...??
     
  6. westcliffe01

    westcliffe01 Well-Known Member

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    Tomorrow, call mansonreamers.com and get a go gauge for a 243Win Ackley Improved. Whoever fitted the barrel may not have done a good job or used the wrong head space gauge.

    I have the same chamber in my Savage and im the process of fireforming a big batch of brass and while I have a little resistance on closing the bolt it is not any less that what you expect with any kind of match ammo. Certainly nothing sloppy about it and I set the headspace myself.
     
  7. pinetree97814

    pinetree97814 New Member

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    I'm with Sully 2 on this one. I have both a 25-06AI and a 280AI and have no trouble w using factory cases for fire forming. Seat the bullets long enough so they contact the rifling and shoot away. I also find that accuracy is very good when fire forming.

    I have no experience with 243's but I think the chamber is an issue. Just my opinion.
     
  8. Marble

    Marble Well-Known Member

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    Same thing with my 7-08AI. It shot regular 708 rounds great, no resistance, no problems.

    I guess whoever did the rechambering didn't head space it correctly or didn't do the set back correctly.
     
  9. wyowinchester

    wyowinchester Well-Known Member

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    You AI should accept almost any regular 243 round. Check the gunsmith's chamber and head spacing.
     
  10. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    +1

    I use a standard 243 go gauge to set the head space on the AI chamber and want it snug (Not hard to close). That way you can shoot standard 243 ammo in it and fire form at the same time.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  11. westcliffe01

    westcliffe01 Well-Known Member

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    Because of the different shoulder angle between 243 Win vs Ackley, it is not recommended to use a regular 243 Win gauge since it would make a line contact and it would be easy to deform the chamber right at the start of the neck if the cam put too much load on the (hardened) gauge.

    If you use a "real" Ackley go gauge, the gauge makes a much broader contact with the shoulder so it would be a lot more difficult to cause any damage. And a properly made Ackley gauge will assure the user of having the right headspace, as intended, to shoot regular 243 Win brass.

    The reason I mentioned Mansonreamer.com, is that they generally have the Ackley gauges in stock, whereas with PTG and most of the other vendors, it is a custom order with a long lead time and higher price.
     
  12. Marble

    Marble Well-Known Member

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    So is the .243 shoulder angle different than other Ackley improved cartridges?

    Shouldn't regular .243 shells fit just fine?
     
  13. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to disagree but the reason that you use a standard 243 Head space gauge is so that you can fire form 243 AI safely and without excessive head space.

    If you use a standard 243 head space go gage It should seat the case at the neck shoulder junction
    and hold the case in place.

    It is recommended that when head spacing you actually have about .003 to .004 crush on the standard case. this also minimizes neck shortening.

    The AI head space gage uses the datum line and the standard 243 case has a different datum
    line because of the shoulder angle and will have to much head space if you fire a standard 243 round in it. once fire formed, or if you buy 243 AI ammo it is fine.

    Some Fire form using the bullet against the lands to maintain head space but the bullets have to be seated farther out and pressures become an issue.

    So, If you chamber with a 243 AI reamer and buy pre formed brass or loaded ammo then it is recommended that you use the 243AI head space gauge.

    If you use a 243 AI reamer to chamber with but you want to shoot standard 243 ammo in it and fire form at the same time head space the AI chamber with the standard 243 head space gage.

    After fire forming, the 243 AI dies will work fine and can be adjusted to fit the chamber.

    J E CUSTOM
    to
     
  14. mustang58

    mustang58 Well-Known Member

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    What does the bolt feel like when you try to chamber a standard .243? if it feels as if you run into a rock wall maybe you have a tight neck chamber. If the bolt almost closes and is hard to cam over you probably are bumping against the shoulder. I would have a gunsmith check it.