.22-250 AI, .22-6mm or .243

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by doubleD, Nov 8, 2004.

  1. doubleD

    doubleD Active Member

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    Want a round for 500-600 yards for deer/antelope/yotes. Thinking .22-250 AI, .22-6mm or the good ol .243. With the new 65gr from Sierra, should be good for deer/antelope. Has anyone tried the 75gr A Max on larger animals? I have a .25-06, but would like another rifle for a back-up. I have dies and bullets for the .243, but I would like to try some fast twist bullets out of a .22 centerfire. If I don't go with the .243, it will give me a reason to buy one down the road, since I have the components!!!! What do you guys think?
     
  2. Aussie

    Aussie Well-Known Member

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    DoubleD ,
    Lots of wiser people than me think that 1000 foot pounds of retained energy is a reasonable minimum for deer . The .22's will struggle to give you that at 600 yards , even with 80gn VLD's.
    Should get around 3300 fps with 80gn out of the .22/250AI , more with the .22/6mm but have read of problems with integrity / accuracy of .22 VLD's at those velocities .
    .243 would also need VLD's at that range to retain 1000 FPE which would mean an 8 inch twist barrel .

    [ 11-08-2004: Message edited by: Aussie ]

    [ 11-08-2004: Message edited by: Aussie ]
     

  3. TOM H

    TOM H Well-Known Member

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    Might want to check but here in Colorado for big game which includes deer and antelope you cann't use anything smaller than a 6mm caliber.
     
  4. Charles A

    Charles A Well-Known Member

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    Ten words, 243 Akley Improved, 105 grain A-Max, 8 twist barrel. [​IMG]
     
  5. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    I might start a pissing match here but I would never consider taking a shot at a deer size target with any of these rounds at 400 yards let alone 500 to 600 yards.

    There are just far better rounds for the job that do not generate much more recoil.

    Coyotes, you bet, all day long, hammer away.

    Pronghorns, sure with heavy bullets in fast twists, still 500 yards is a poke with the 22 cals of any size on this size game.

    Why not get into something like a fast twist 6mm-06. Built one last spring for a guy on a 28" Kreiger 1-9" barrel that is shooting the 105 gr A-Max bullets into the .3's at 3500 fps.

    For taking a deer at 500 yards, this is where I would consider the minimum level of power, far above any 22 cal or 243 Win.

    This is also one of the easiest wildcats to load for, run a 25-06 brass thoughthe full length sizer and load and shoot, there you go. Feed like silk with its shallow shoulder, is very accurate and has the power and trajectory for takin gshots at game ou to 500 yards or a bit beyond.

    To be honest, your 25-06 is a better round then all of them if you use the proper bullet with the a stout load.

    Good Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  6. doubleD

    doubleD Active Member

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    Thanks for all of the responses. Who cares if you start a pissing match, none of this is set in stone, just each person's thoughts. Fiftydriver, the reason I went these, is I have a short action. What about a 6-284? Should be about the same as a 6-06? I don't mind recoil, but I like the smaller rounds. Haven't got into elk hunting,so I don't need a magnum. I thought about getting another .25-06, but need something different. Any other suggestion, keep them coming! Thanks again
     
  7. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    DoubleD,

    Nothing at all wrong with the 6mm-284, hell of a round and yes it is basically the same thing as the standard 6mm-06.

    Only benefit I see with the 6mm06 over the 6mm-284 is the 06 cases are easier to get and they will feed better.

    I have not had a real problem with any of the 6mm-284s I have built as far as feeding goes but they have all been Rem 700 actions.

    Ever though of a 6.5mm WSM? Designed a reamer for this wildcat this summer and it is producing some very impressive performance.

    This is a better hunting round then target/varmint/com round because its throat life will be a little shorter then the 6.5-284 but it will provide a lifetime of big game hunting.

    It will run real close to a 264 Win Mag in performance with about 8 grains less powder. I built myself an XP-100 handgun with a 15" Lilja barrel and it is a tack driver. Averages in the .350" range for three shot groups with the 120 gr Ballistic Tip loaded to 3100 fps in the handgun.

    Took a doe mule deer at a measured 332 yards this season with it. Took out both shoulders and dropped her where she stood. The 120 BT exited as well.

    Good Shooting!!

    Just another option to confuse things. The 6.5 WSM with the 140 gr A-Max would ba a great long range deer round.

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  8. chris matthews

    chris matthews Well-Known Member

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    I agree with Fiftydriver- for a SA the 6.5 WSM would be hard to beat, I built one for myself and am now building a 6.5 WSSM also. Another thought would be go with the good ol 308 lots of good ammo and will get the job done if you don't want to go the WSM route.

    Almost forgot the 260 Ackley... another thought as well....

    [ 11-09-2004: Message edited by: chris matthews ]
     
  9. LB

    LB Well-Known Member

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    You have a lot of interesting (and worthy) suggestions, doubleD. You can go as exotic as you like, but there is nothing wrong with a plain vanilla 243 or 6MM Rem. If you want something sexy and efficient, Mr Arbuckle already suggested the 243 Ackley with a fast twist. It's so good, (and so popular) it has lost a little of the allure, but hey!

    Where do you stand on throat life? If you must have a hot rock .224, my vote goes for the 22-250 Ackley. Great performance from an efficient case design. You could go much higher capacity, but they don't last very long.

    Good hunting. LB
     
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Oh the .22hotrod doubters. 22-6mm Imp , 8twist, 80gr SMKS or 75gr Amax. just think only have to click up 18mins to get on @ 1000yds, its a good feeling shooting that lazer across the open valleys. shouldnt have any problems with a 80grSMKS on those animals @ that distance. good luck to you, either way you go, have fun and shoot often.
     
  11. milanuk

    milanuk Well-Known Member

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    Kind of the veing I'd be leaning towards... .260 Rem (6.5-08), .260 AI, or 6.5x55 Swede, running 120-130gr bullets around 3k or so. High BC, flat shooting, low wind drift, low recoil, good barrel life.

    Monte
     
  12. lynn

    lynn Well-Known Member

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    DoubleD
    Another option here.Make a 7 twist 243 WSSM and use the new 115 gr SMK that David Tubb has out.Bc is .585 and a 28 inch barrel will push them 3300 fps.Your short action will work just fine once you get the bolt face opened up(cheap job).
    As the other posters have said the fast twist 6mm's obsolete the 22 centefires as far as trajectory and downrange energy or concerned.
    If you limit your range to 600 yards the 6BR with an 8 twist barrel is simpy unbelievable shooting 107 Sierras.Flat shooting,easy on barrels,easy to load for and arguably the most accurate 600 yard gun today.
    Lynn
     
  13. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Lynn,

    While accuracy is tops I beliee we would all agree on that, there does have to be some terminal performance for game to be cleanly harvested.

    I do not feel the Matchkings in the smaller calibers are viable big game bullets. Once you get into the 7mm, 308 and 338 class you bet but not in 22 and 6mm.

    I also find your 3300 fps velocity with the 115 gr bullet in a 243 WSSM a bit optomistic in a 28" barrel. Not only is the baring surface greatly increased with these bullets, the very fast 1-7 twist will also limit velocity as well.

    My 6mm-284 will drive the 107gr Mk to honest 3500 fps levels out of its 30" Lilja 1-8", 3 groove barrel.

    From the data I have studied, the WSSM will not top the 6mm-284 at all, in fact from what I have seen from actual hard data, it is running about 100 to 150 fps behind the 6mm-284.

    Combine that with the faster twist and shorter barrel adn I would say the 243 WSSM would be hard pressed to hit 3150 with the 115 gr pills out of a 30" barrel let alone a 28" pipe.

    Again accuracy is key to bullet placement but once the bullet lands on the right spot, it still needs a certain amount of energy and expansion to perform on game.

    The Mk bullets tend to cave in on themselves and expand to small frontal areas. They often penetrate very deep and in the larger calibers are great game slayers but not in the small calibers in my experience.

    Also getting a short action receiver to feed the WSSM rounds when they are not designed for them can be a real pain in the rear. If your buildign a single shot, which I would recommend anyway, this is obviously not a problem.

    Good Shooting!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    DoubleD,
    FiftyDriver makes some very good real life shooting/hunting points, and I'm gonna have to side with him. Good Shootin'