200 Gameking vs 210 Berger

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Tang, Nov 21, 2009.

  1. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    I know the Berger is better at long range, but which one would be better if a shot happened to be at 100 yards or less ?

    Loading them for my .300 Ultra Mag. I have the Retumbo and Federal 215's waiting.

    I'm asking, because even though my Sendero weighs 10.6 lbs, I will probably still carry it around to my favorite hunting spots next weekend. Some of those places shots can be as little as 30-75 yards.
     
  2. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    There is a lot of discussion and debate about this subject. The Berger seems to be a very effective bullet most of the time, but I've read some reports of non-expansion or little to no penetration due to under expansion. Another issue for me is bloodshot meat. I eat my game and butcher it myself. The VLD's tend to ruin a lot more meat from what I've read and heard. My philosophy is not to use them at close range if I use them at all.

    Right now, my go to load is 180 E-tips with an MV of 3400 fps. At an elevation of 5000', the E-Tips get to just under 1100 yds with 1800 fps velocity which is their minimum expansion velocity. At 3150 fps the 210 Bergers get about 50 yds farther with a little more enrgy/momentum.

    The E-Tips are shooting very well and I dont see a need to use the 210's for the more extreme ranges, because I dont see a big benefit. After recovering an E-Tip in the dirt from target shooting, I am very impressed with what I see. It will put a major hurting on what ever it hits.

    Having said that, I do have some of the thick jacketed 210 VLD loaded and will give them a try at ranges inside 500 yds on a cow elk if I get the chance. This is based on the fact that the thick jacket VLDs tapper down in thickness to the meplat and should proved expansion. I am very interested in seeing their performance.

    In the LR game, I look for well performing, relatively high BC bullets which include E-Tips and AB's.

    Just my $.03 :)

    Mark
     

  3. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah, I toted my Sendero & NXS around for about 16 miles yesterday :rolleyes::D
     
  4. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    How do you get 3400 fps ? Geez thats smoking !

    I use Accubonds in my 7mm RM and 338 WM, they work great !
     
  5. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    I've seen 3400 with the 180 E-Tips with Retumbo, H1000 and RL17. That's a typical velocity for that weight bullet in the 300 RUM.
     
  6. bigngreen

    bigngreen Well-Known Member

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    My dad had a 210 Berger out of a 300WBY poke through a deer the other day just over 250yrds, it was back and didn't hit bone could not even tell there was a hole there till we got the hide down, I was ready to see a mess. I think if you hit bone they will torch them down or punch an elk with it's greater mass.
    I'm loading both the Bergers and Accubond and pack both just in case the Berger fails the first shot.
     
  7. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    I would include 200gr Accubonds in this question, but they are sold out everywhere. I most definetly will be using the 200gr Accubond as my all around load for deer and maybe an Elk trip.

    Would I be giving up much if I used the 180 Accubond ?
     
  8. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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  9. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    Midway has the 200gr Accubond on back order. Im iffy about trying any Barnes product, because I dont want to foul my barrel up.

    Im breaking the barrel in with 180gr Hornady Interlocks, with a load of 83gr of RL22.

    I'm probably going to order some 210gr VLD's, and use the 200gr Gamekings that I have here for punching paper and setting off Tannerite.
     
  10. elkaholic

    elkaholic Well-Known Member

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    To answer the original question, I'd take the game king over the berger for shots under 400 yds........Rich
     
  11. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    Guys what do you think about running a 168gr Barnes TSX at high speed ?
     
  12. LongBomber

    LongBomber Well-Known Member

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    I run the 200gr accubond in my 300rum. The gamekings are a little to soft and really fragment from my 300wsm, so I didn't try them in the RUM. I have shot several deer at under 30 yards with the RUM and the accubonds, which run 3247fps from my rifle, and all have had serious wound channels, but no tracking was required, they seem to be "numbed" from the impact. I think in total it's been 4 whitetail, 3 black bear a moose and 1 elk, all with the accubond between 20 and 400 yards. The "wock" of the bullet impact is far louder than any other rifle I have. I have also fired them into dry newspaper from 100 to 500 yards. They seem to hold together well, and were very accurate for me.

    I have also fired the 165,168 and 180 tsx. They shot flat enough but the wind pushed them around more than the accubonds, and my average group size went from .3moa to .5moa. I couldn't get them to shoot any better with 3 different powders and a few seating depths. I gave up before using up more barrel life. I use them in my 300wsm, and they shoot very well and work well on game.

    I picked up some berger 190gr hunting VLD's last weekend to try out. The 210's were sold out, so I thought I would give the 190's a go. Hopefully they shoot well in my rifle.
     
  13. MontanaRifleman

    MontanaRifleman Well-Known Member

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    Not something I would do in the 300 RUM. IMO, it's a waste of the cartridge. The TSX has a BC of .404 and the TTSX has a BC of .470. The 180 E-Tip has a BC of .523. The smallest bullet (other than the GS HV 177) that I would run out of the RUM would be a 180 and the only 180 I would run would be the E-Tip because of the high velocities and it's a monometal. The smalles jacketed bullet I would run would be 200 grains and the smallest explosive type bullets would be the 208 AMax or 210 Berger. I'm not really a big fan of the Barnes bullets because they have low BC's, are pure copper and would probably foul more than other bullets, and reports of failure to expand.

    Get a bullet that will get the most out of your ultra :)
     
  14. Tang

    Tang Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the help