Acrylic Primer Sealer

[Aldon]

On another thread there was discussion that Primers can be known to slowly slip from their initial seating depth. Obvious problems ensue.

Has anyone any experience using the Acrylic Primer sealers?

Just wondering if there are negatives I need to be aware of.

It seems to me, that it might aid in resisting slipping.

This is link to one type:
Bullet and Primer Sealer direct from Markron Gun Products

 

[MT4XFore]

Personally, I have never found a need to seal my primers. I dont plan on immersing my boolits in water so they shouldn't need waterproofing. If your primers are backing out, your primer pockets are too loose and the case should be disgarded. If it will make you feel better to seal, by all means do it. It's just another expense and time consumer as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Rev.]

I only seal my pistol rounds & a few hunting rounds. The only reason is I feel better because I took an extra step in prepation for rounds that may see rough times.

 

[Aldon]

Personally, I have never found a need to seal my primers. I dont plan on immersing my boolits in water so they shouldn't need waterproofing. If your primers are backing out, your primer pockets are too loose and the case should be disgarded. If it will make you feel better to seal, by all means do it. It's just another expense and time consumer as far as I'm concerned.

This is the thread and I believe the two senior forum members have credibility. The the issue of having primers ease from a consistent depth is the reason I am contemplating the sealer....

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f28/primer-failure-66038/

 

[MT4XFore]

I stand by my previous post. In over 50 years of reloading, I've never had primers "back" out on me.

 

[Mikecr]

I stand by my previous post. In over 50 years of reloading, I've never had primers "back" out on me.

How do you know this?
How have you measured it?
Do you think your primers & pockets are exactly the same as everyone else's?

You do realize that Aldon is not talking about 'backing out' to a point of falling out, or misfire, Right? He's talking about creeping over time to ANY point different than originally seated.

I suspect this occurs with any brass still 'alive'. It's fresh springback lessening with time. Neck tension does this as well, and so do headspace settings. It comes right back with a new sizing cycle. So where the hell did it go? I don't know..
It's subtle, and shooters so into precision to notice often do not, because they load what they shoot -just beforehand.
It's my contention that this is a good idea. If I were a competitor, I could not pull OLD ammo out of a safe and head to line with any confidence, no matter how standardized my processes. I would want to see every aspect of this combination working exactly as needed, and precisely duplicated, with validation of a sample of this duplication, just before needed use... If that makes sense..

But I'm a woodchuck hunter, and can afford to lay back alittle. I have way more time to prepare and validate that I am prepared. So months in advance, I seat primers with an extra 1thou crush, partial size necks an extra 50thou in length, and bump shoulders an extra 1thou, all based on logged settings. This ammo will NOT be used for 2months atleast. Then, a week before hunting, I validate my shooting system with samples of this ammo. It should be perfect.
I cannot drive 650mi, and have a mangy marmot go caddyshack on me, without immediate schooling that this human is different.

Anyway, sealing the primers might work to stop creeping. I don't know with the forces in play here. It would have to be tested specifically for this.

 

[Trickymissfit]

I stand by my previous post. In over 50 years of reloading, I've never had primers "back" out on me.

I currently have about three hundred rounds invarious flavors setting on a table top waiting to have the primers reseated. A hundred of them I never loaded, but when I did a check on a half dozen once fired cases out of those groups, I found that the spent cases still had the primers well under the case head. Yet the loaded ones all had the primer about four to five thousandths above the case head. I punch out three or four spent cases to see what the pockets looked like, and they had never been reamed. Some of the cases were Winchester .243, and some were Remington .243. So I'm not seeing a brand name problem here. A check with some primed .222 brass showed the samething, but still slightly under the face. I check three lots of 45LC loaded rounds, and see similar things. The primed,but unloaded cases were OK. Samething for my 44 mag stuff. My 30 Herrett stuff seemed to be all over the place, but still under the case head. I've still got a couple hundred 30-06 cases to check out (all sized and primed). Luck has it that I hadn't loaded any .270 mag, and 38-55 rounds since the last time out! Also have not took the time to work over any .450 and .444 cases since the last time I beat up.

I so I called my brother up to tell him about this primer fiasco, and of course I was nuts! An hour later he calls me up to tell me he has similar results with another major problem (I'll tell you guys about this later as we still don't know what's going on)
gary

 

[Trickymissfit]

How do you know this?
How have you measured it?
Do you think your primers & pockets are exactly the same as everyone else's?

You do realize that Aldon is not talking about 'backing out' to a point of falling out, or misfire, Right? He's talking about creeping over time to ANY point different than originally seated.

I suspect this occurs with any brass still 'alive'. It's fresh springback lessening with time. Neck tension does this as well, and so do headspace settings. It comes right back with a new sizing cycle. So where the hell did it go? I don't know..
It's subtle, and shooters so into precision to notice often do not, because they load what they shoot -just beforehand.
It's my contention that this is a good idea. If I were a competitor, I could not pull OLD ammo out of a safe and head to line with any confidence, no matter how standardized my processes. I would want to see every aspect of this combination working exactly as needed, and precisely duplicated, with validation of a sample of this duplication, just before needed use... If that makes sense..

But I'm a woodchuck hunter, and can afford to lay back alittle. I have way more time to prepare and validate that I am prepared. So months in advance, I seat primers with an extra 1thou crush, partial size necks an extra 50thou in length, and bump shoulders an extra 1thou, all based on logged settings. This ammo will NOT be used for 2months atleast. Then, a week before hunting, I validate my shooting system with samples of this ammo. It should be perfect.
I cannot drive 650mi, and have a mangy marmot go caddyshack on me, without immediate schooling that this human is different.

Anyway, sealing the primers might work to stop creeping. I don't know with the forces in play here. It would have to be tested specifically for this.

I have an idea, and again it may well out in left field. I'm see the problems with loaded brass about 99% of the time. I'm wondering if the powder is building up a gas inside the case, and with the bullet seating area being much greater square inches in area (refering to the grip), as well as the diameter; the easiest thing to move would be the primer. With gas pressure it's all pneumatics, and the smaller diameter will be easiest to move with less pressure needed.
gary

 

[Aldon]

Thanks guys for the data driven discourse.

I do not shoot competition but would like my reloading efforts to allow me to generate ammo that will always be equal to the task that I and my equipment are capable of.

At this point I am still skilling up beyond the basics having spent a lot of time and resources trying to improve my skills.

I can not see how the sealer would be detrimental and on off chance it is helpful, I plan to try it. If it is gases, then I may want more neck tension than I currently have if I seal the Primer....

I tend to hold up during the winters coldest nastiest weather and tinker with reloading and rifles. So my loaded rounds may sit for 2-3 months before I head to the range. My hunting is primarily in the fall.

 

[Buffalobob]

When you insert a bullet into a primed case you may effectively pressurize the case as the bullet will act as a piston going in. I suspect it is complicated by the amount of powder and voids in the case and the tightness of the primer pocket.

I have noticed what I always presumed to be a poor job of seating primers on my part. It may well be that I actually backed them out in the bullet seating process.

An interesting thought has been presented that bears some observation.

The problem with the sealer is that it will add a layer of thickness to the brass head and may well transfer back onto the bolt face.

 

[Trickymissfit]

When you insert a bullet into a primed case you may effectively pressurize the case as the bullet will act as a piston going in. I suspect it is complicated by the amount of powder and voids in the case and the tightness of the primer pocket.

I have noticed what I always presumed to be a poor job of seating primers on my part. It may well be that I actually backed them out in the bullet seating process.

An interesting thought has been presented that bears some observation.

The problem with the sealer is that it will add a layer of thickness to the brass head and may well transfer back onto the bolt face.

I wonder if you could seal the primers with a very light coating of shellac? The stuff goes on very thin.
gary