Sporter weight barrel as a LR rifle ?

[cmillett79]

Looking at maybe building a LR rig on a M 700 action and a 26" sporter weight barrel in 7mm rem mag ... RIfle will be used for hunting deer ( and smaller game ) out to 600-700 yds (maybe 800) .. Just curious if anyone is aboe to get the accuracy needed for this out of sporter weight barrels.

Thanks

 

[winmag]

Looking at maybe building a LR rig on a M 700 action and a 26" sporter weight barrel in 7mm rem mag ... RIfle will be used for hunting deer ( and smaller game ) out to 600-700 yds (maybe 800) .. Just curious if anyone is aboe to get the accuracy needed for this out of sporter weight barrels.

Thanks

I dont know that Id choose to order a sporter wt. bbl, but that being said, theres quite a few factory barreled rifles that are capable of doing the task. Luck of the draw I suppose. But if I were ordering a bbl strictly for a L/R rig Id probably go with a #5 or #6 taper from a reputable barrel maker(shillen, kreiger, lilja, broughten etc.) sorry my spelling SUCKS! If wt. is a concern Id get a fluted bbl.

 

[royinidaho]

My response to this would be that I took a Rem 700 LH in 338 Win Mag stuck a brake on it, redid the outside of the stock plus pillar bedded. Shot exceptionally well with 225s and 250s.

However, Win Mag just wasn't 'nifty' enough so I had a local smith fit a 26" Rem 338 RUM new take off barrel that I got from Kirby Allen for next to about nuthin'. Had the brake moved to it also.

Doesn't shoot 225s or 250s very well but does wonders with 300 SMKs.

It's my carry gun but is tuned to go 875 yds.

The only reason for not going farther is limitations of the Mil Dot reticle and 1/8th minute clicks that I don't trust and certainly can't count.

Your largest consideration is weight. Heavier just seems better the farther ya shoot. But that isn't always the case.

Give it a go.....and see what happens.

 

[Pdvdh]

Looking at maybe building a LR rig on a M 700 action and a 26" sporter weight barrel in 7mm rem mag ... RIfle will be used for hunting deer ( and smaller game ) out to 600-700 yds (maybe 800) .. Just curious if anyone is aboe to get the accuracy needed for this out of sporter weight barrels.

Thanks

If you reload and tune a load to the rifle, 600-700 yds should be no problem with a lighter profile barrel. Some factory rifles will fill that role nicely. I've got two Tikka T3 7mm Rem Mags and they both perform acceptably well out to 800 yds with some finely tuned hand loaded ammo. And those rifles weigh 6 3/8 lbs with 24 3/8" long barrels.

 

[cmillett79]

Thanks for the reply people .. Just to add I will be reloading for it .. I will be loading 150-175 gr bulletts.. Reason I chose the 7mm rem mag is the bullett diameter is still small enough to not thin the barrel as a 30cal or larger would..Also that I am familar with loading for the 7mm mag and I also already have all the reloading gear for it...I was looking at starting with a used stailnless SPS barreled action pillar bedded into a laminated Ross thumbhole from boyds , and then take it from there. Starting the build would be under $700 bucks so I dont think thats to bad unless I decide to go with a bit heavier barrel .. I would like the rifle not to be as heavy as a sendero , which I know a sendero is not heavy when it comes to LR rifles .. Just sometrhing I wouldnt mind carrying around in my pastures that will be just as dependable and accurate as the heavier rifles out to 600-800yds.

 

[Fitch]

Have you considered going with a shorter barrel?

Sort of "thinking out loud" here.

This is a hunting rifle so the reason for a heavier barrel would be to get stiffness for accuracy purposes while keeping the velocity that goes with a 26" barrel. The additional mass to compensate for heating isn't needed on a hunting rifle (1 shot most of the time, very rarely 3 shots) like it would be on a competition rifle. Reducing the length would stiffen the barrel with the sacrifice some velocity but probably have a negligable effect on the rifles usefulness for the hunting described.

Taking 4" to 6" off the sporter weight 26" barrel should stiffen it up noticably. The MV loss can be compensated for by using good range data out to the distances you mention and shouldn't affect it's ability to take the game you discuss at those ranges.

Not recommending anything here because I haven't studied it. But it might be worth thinking about especially if you already have a sporter length barrel that can be cut down to experiment with.

Fitch

 

[cmillett79]

Have you considered going with a shorter barrel?

Sort of "thinking out loud" here.

This is a hunting rifle so the reason for a heavier barrel would be to get stiffness for accuracy purposes while keeping the velocity that goes with a 26" barrel. The additional mass to compensate for heating isn't needed on a hunting rifle (1 shot most of the time, very rarely 3 shots) like it would be on a competition rifle. Reducing the length would stiffen the barrel with the sacrifice some velocity but probably have a negligable effect on the rifles usefulness for the hunting described.

Taking 4" to 6" off the sporter weight 26" barrel should stiffen it up noticably. The MV loss can be compensated for by using good range data out to the distances you mention and shouldn't affect it's ability to take the game you discuss at those ranges.

Not recommending anything here because I haven't studied it. But it might be worth thinking about especially if you already have a sporter length barrel that can be cut down to experiment with.

Fitch

You just explained one of my greatest concerns Fitch .. This is one thing that I am thinking about..Honestly Id like to keep the barrel length 26" if possible in the 7mm mag..If I have to go 24" or less I would go with a NONmag standard caliber..I once had a 280 and a 7mm mag .. The 280 had a 22" barrel and the mag 24" .. The difference in vel. was min. when pushing "accurate" loads in the same bullet weight..There was no real world advantage with the mag .. This was after a couple months worth of trial loads .. I believe the 280 in 150gr sierras (neck sized) was only 80-120 fps slower than the 7mm mag with the same bullet but loaded for accuracy.. I think the mag was pushing it at 2950+/- and the 280 was a hair over 2850fps.. This is one reason if I saty with the 7mm mag to keep the barrel lengtrh at least 26" ... I wonder if going with a one contour heavier barrel than factory and adding flutes would stiffen it or maybe having it chryo'ed ?

 

[Fitch]

You just explained one of my greatest concerns Fitch .. This is one thing that I am thinking about..Honestly Id like to keep the barrel length 26" if possible in the 7mm mag..If I have to go 24" or less I would go with a NONmag standard caliber..I once had a 280 and a 7mm mag .. The 280 had a 22" barrel and the mag 24" .. The difference in vel. was min. when pushing "accurate" loads in the same bullet weight..There was no real world advantage with the mag .. This was after a couple months worth of trial loads .. I believe the 280 in 150gr sierras (neck sized) was only 80-120 fps slower than the 7mm mag with the same bullet but loaded for accuracy.. I think the mag was pushing it at 2950+/- and the 280 was a hair over 2850fps.. This is one reason if I saty with the 7mm mag to keep the barrel lengtrh at least 26" ... I wonder if going with a one contour heavier barrel than factory and adding flutes would stiffen it or maybe having it chryo'ed ?

Chryogenic treatment won't do anything for stiffness - that's controlled by section moment and Young's modulus which aren't changed by chryogenic treatment. The Chryo treatment should increase stability, i.e. the barrel will shift less due to temperature change, but that isn't usually an issue in a 1 or two shot hunting rifle.

Based on what you said, wanting to keep the MV up, if it were me I'd go with a #5 taper barrel. It's a nice compromise between sporter and benchrest.

I have a 7mm Rem Mag Savage BVSS coming (should be here a week from Friday) that has something approaching a #7 taper barrel on it. That's for a rifle intended for hunting from stands - it will weigh almost 12 lbs to 12.5 lbs with scope. It's heavier than you have in mind.

Fitch

 

[Boss Hoss]

If built properly there is very little difference in hunting accuracy requirements. My 4.5 Krieger contours shoot bug holes but are built the same way with the same components as one of my match rifles. Example is my 6.5x284 the 16.8lb at 300 yards will shoot .15 MOA and so does the 8lb with scope sporter using the same ammo. Now if I were to rattle 15 rounds off in 3 or 4 minutes the Lt Wt would be at a disadvantage but there are many things besides tube wt to consider. Have fired 5 as fast as could load from the right side which is tough when feeding (competition actions are RBLP) individually about 45 seconds and shot perfect.

Bottom line no difference for huntingand I have several---the builder and the components are the key.

 

[Pdvdh]

You just explained one of my greatest concerns Fitch .. This is one thing that I am thinking about..Honestly Id like to keep the barrel length 26" if possible in the 7mm mag..If I have to go 24" or less I would go with a NONmag standard caliber..I once had a 280 and a 7mm mag .. The 280 had a 22" barrel and the mag 24" .. The difference in vel. was min. when pushing "accurate" loads in the same bullet weight..There was no real world advantage with the mag .. This was after a couple months worth of trial loads .. I believe the 280 in 150gr sierras (neck sized) was only 80-120 fps slower than the 7mm mag with the same bullet but loaded for accuracy.. I think the mag was pushing it at 2950+/- and the 280 was a hair over 2850fps.. This is one reason if I saty with the 7mm mag to keep the barrel lengtrh at least 26" ... I wonder if going with a one contour heavier barrel than factory and adding flutes would stiffen it or maybe having it chryo'ed ?

I've chronographed extensive load development for my 24 3/8" barreled 7mm Rem Mag and 28" barreled 280 Improved with the same Berger 168 VLD bullets. My MV with maximum, accurate loads for the 7mm Rem Mag is 3050 fps. MV with max loads and good accuracy in the 280 Improved are 2920 to 2950 fps. So the 7mm RM gives me 100 - 130 fps higher MVs in the substantially (3 5/8") shorter barrel.

The heavier the bullet, the greater the increase in the MV of the 7mm RM over the 280.

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

I have quite a few 26" #3 barrels that shoot very well for hunting accuracy at the range you indicated. I would have no problem with a 7mm rem mag in a 26" barrel at that range.

 

[Moman]

I agree with the other posters, you should have no problem getting out to 800 yds or so. I have been shooting a factory 24" 300 WM and it has been very accurate out to 800, and have even taken it to just over 1,000. The barrel finally went south on it and I had it rebarreled with a Broughton 4.1 contour finished at 25". With the factory barrel and McMillan Edge stock, the gun alone wieghed 6.75 lbs, with the new barrel it is just under 7-1/4 lbs. I have other heavier barreled rifles which do better at longer distances, but for a light weight carry gun, I appreciate the 7-1/4 lb rifle.

I forgot if you said you were looking at barrel ideas as well, If you are, take a look at that 4.1 contour that Broughton does.

 

[cmillett79]

I've chronographed extensive load development for my 24 3/8" barreled 7mm Rem Mag and 28" barreled 280 Improved with the same Berger 168 VLD bullets. My MV with maximum, accurate loads for the 7mm Rem Mag is 3050 fps. MV with max loads and good accuracy in the 280 Improved are 2920 to 2950 fps. So the 7mm RM gives me 100 - 130 fps higher MVs in the substantially (3 5/8") shorter barrel.

The heavier the bullet, the greater the increase in the MV of the 7mm RM over the 280.

Yes sir I agree with you on the fact that with heavier bullets the mag shines.. But at the time in that case that a described it wasnt practical in my eyes having to do with those 2 rifles I was speaking of .

 

[cmillett79]

Thanks for all the posts my friends.. It has helped alot.. Im thinking I may go with what I had in mind since the rifle intended purpose will not be for a ton of bench shooting and not a comp rilfe either .. It will be used mainly for hunting in my pastures out to 600-800yds.. Going on what Ive read so far , I shouldnt have a problemwith a properly built sproter weight rifle reaching out to thise ranges for a shot or 2 accurately.