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Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

 
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  #162  
Old 05-14-2011, 10:42 PM
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Location: Eastern North Carolina
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Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

Hi,

Interesting article and the assment of it. Not sure I came away with the same conclusion some of you did. I reload both Barnes and Berger bullets and like them both as well as the Nosler Ballistic tips. I have used Barnes bullets longer than I have the Bergers and get great accuracy out of the barnes TTSX bullets I reload in 270, 270 WSM, 30-06 and 243 Win without much worry with bullet seating depth. However, I find bullet seating depth seems a bit more critical when loading the Berger VLD hunting bullets. However, the Berger VLD's require no sortng by weight as they are extreamly weight consistant.
Of course with any bullet twist rate is can be a factor as well but maybe slightly more so with the Bergers.

In reading the 100 yard accuracy results posted by Barnes I can believe their results but I also know the VLD's with a little tweeking are capable of much better accuracy than the VLD test bullets Barnes used.

I also have to wonder which VLD bullet Barnes used in the Gelletin Test. The VLD hunting bullet or the VLD Target Bullet as I'm sure there is a differance in their capability to penatrate bone and geletin.

I have had a lot personal experience hunting with both the Barnes TTSX and the Ballistic Tips. Both the Ballistic Tips and the Barnes TTSX are very accurate but I have to say for shots under 250 yds I better trust the Barnes in the high velocity rifles I shoot. Most deer I have shot with the Barnes don't run at all, they just drop. The few that do, don't run far and I always get a pass thru.

The Ballistic tips do somewhat explode on impact using high velocity bullets which at times can be good as they can make a huge hole but sometimes they don't achive great penetration. However I do appreciate the more reasonable price per bullet and good accuracy of the Ballistic Tip.
If I were using a lower velocity bullet like a 30-30 or shooting a very heavy bullet per caliber or shooting at Very long range I might better trust the Ballitic tips. I feel like at a lower velocity expansion would be less violent , and better chance of good expansion and less fragmentation.

I can't really comment on the Berger VLD hunting bullets for hunting use but I can see some great potential there as I have worked up some very accurate loads and hope to test them in the 2011 hunting season.

I keep an open mind to the heavy slower bullet/VS the faster lighter bullet. I've seen where velocity kills and I believe the Barnes Bullets are better suited to high velocity than some. In the south where I hunt, the deer are generally smaller and many hunters have gone to lighter calibers with great success. My friends wife hunts with with a 243 winchester and shoots many deer a year most dropping upon impact but she is a crack shot and 80% of her shots are under a 200 yrds. She's only lost one deer in many years of hunting which she shot with a ballistic tip that hit the shoulder. They later found the deer but they no longer hunt with the standard ballistic tips.

I'll try to post something this fall/winter on my success or lack of using the Berger VlD hunting bullets. I am also hoping to go on a western Elk hunt this year with a friend and may use the Berger VLD's. Shooting distances may be greater out west than what I'm used to in this area and I believe they could work well at long range but I'll definitely bring along some Barnes bullets as well.

Terry
  #163  
Old 05-15-2011, 09:37 AM
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Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

roughwater
I have used barnes tx/tsx and or smk,s on elk size game for a long time..i use one of my 338 cal. for elk ..they are tough animals and iam sure there are people on this site that have killed more elk then me but i have shot my share at 200 yards usually around 600 yd,s and my longest kill at just under a 1000 yards..
My limited use of bergers says they work great punching holes in paper but not threw animals..you can argue (shock )all you want, but sometimes a bad shot on a elk and no blood trail means a lost animal or a long day looking for it.With the barnes or the smk,s i get either a blood trail or a dead on the spot animal with a big hole on the other side.
There are some gies on this site testing the new 300 gr. bergers.I dont know shawn carlock personally but if after his testing is complete and IF he say they work it may be worth a try..I dont care to mess around with bullet depth as i guess he is doing right now.i dont find that to be a issue with others..i do sometimes sort by weight but not for hunting bullets.
Iam not answering your post to cut berger apart.they make a fine product only not for me ..i will wait for more test results from shawn but for now just like you posted dont leave your barnes behind,because the only way to get a blood trail is threw a hole.
  #164  
Old 05-15-2011, 10:03 AM
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Location: Chelan Co, Washington
Posts: 519
Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

Roughwater, welcome to the site!

Seems you have formulated your opinions on various bullets through experience of your own, and observing the results from other hunters. Excellent! Bullets do have different characteristics, and we're living in a time when we have many choices of good bullets for different applications.

Let's hope we all meet with success this coming season.

Regards, Guy
  #165  
Old 05-15-2011, 02:38 PM
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Eastern North Carolina
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Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

Hi Extreme, and Guy and thanks for the welcome and for your info on this issue. I was also glad to see Eric's post as well. I have used Barne's bullets at mostly ranges under 200 yrds and I wasn't sure how effective they were at long range but your post's have helped reassure me they probably are plenty effective out to as far as I would trust myself to take a shot.

One thing that has helped keep my interest in Berger bullets is that the company is not disattached from it's customers like so many companies are. When I had questions about bullet load data and e-mailed their website, Walt Berger personally emailed me back with the info I requested and with other follow up e-mails. What other company does that? I guarentee not many and again right here on this website on this thread, Eric Steckler chimes in. This tells me that the company cares and is personally involved. I'm not likely to quit using Barnes bullets but I'm sure going to give the Bergers my most serious try at hunting. Like I said earlier, I like the fact that the Berger's are very weight consitant, morso than any other bullet I have ever used. Add that to the fact they have a longer streamlined profile compared with other bullets and it just feels like a great combination for accuracy. My main concern now is how they perform on game. I plan to try them myself this fall and build some for a couple friends who take a lot of deer and I'll report our personal experience with them, thumbs up or thumbs down.

Terry
  #166  
Old 05-18-2011, 09:57 AM
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Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

This is what Barnes are good for:

222rem 53TSX at 3200fps@ muzz









I had to shoot through a lot of heavy bone to stop this one under the skin
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  #167  
Old 05-18-2011, 10:27 AM
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Location: Brusly, LA
Posts: 162
Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

I guess it was the Tip on the TTSX, or something, that allowed them to break the petals off those bullets. I've never 'broken' a TSX or TTSX. The above went in 53gn, and came out 53gn; and that's trough both leg bones and a scapula of a 120lbs Whitetail doe. The only Barnes bullets I can think of that I've nocked petals off, were the 110XPBs designed for 38spl, that I pushed out of a 357mag Rifle at 2400fps. Even then, they only shed 1 or 2, and retained the body of the bullet.


The test on Barnes don't seem to show there point to well. The Noslers and Bergers seem to do pretty good for passing through bone, both at 100 and 1000. The TTSXs penetrate well, but I wonder about the BC issue. I doubt the Barnes bullets have as high a BC as the Berger VLDs, no matter how you measure it.
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To teach those that don't know, To remind those that do Know, To correct those that think they know.
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  #168  
Old 05-18-2011, 10:39 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 276
Re: Barnes's Tests Prove Why Berger Hunting VLDs Are So Successful By Eric Stecker

Roughwater.

the pictures say it all. i see the same results with my barnes loads even on elk size animals..even a bad shot for whatever reason drills a blood trail hole so you wont loose the animal...So until i see proof from shawn or other gies testing the new bergers on elk and putting holes in them such as these i will stick to barnes.
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