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Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

 
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  #8  
Old 01-08-2012, 09:43 AM
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Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowhunter57 View Post
motogunner,
There are a lot of variables with shotguns and getting good patterns out of them. If you can find someone with the same brand and barrel length of shotgun that you own, then I would suggest purchasing the choke tube and ammo that they're using.

I had purchased their Dead Coyote choke tube and patterned it with Dead Coyote ammo (3" chamber) and was getting impressive patterns out to 30 yards. Past the 30 yard mark the patterns were horrible and I would NOT trust them out to 40 or further. The Dead Coyote choke tube measures at a .660" restriction.

I called Carlson's and spoke with one of their technicians, by the name of Scott and he was very helpful in getting the right choke restriction...for my application of coyote hunting. After talking with Scott, I found out that Scott is Scott Carlson, the owner. He suggested a .680 restriction would give me the patterns I was looking to obtain.

The next day, I wondered about shipping the choke, as I had purchased it at Cabelas. I called Carlson's again. This time I got a man on the phone by the name of Shane, Scott's son. He said that he got to do more of the test patterning than his Dad and agreed that the .680" restriction would do the trick. I explained my choke tube purchase and Shane said it didn't matter, it is their choke tube and they'd make it right. All I had to do was put a note in with the choke tube stating "exchange for a .680" restriction" and they'd get it back to me as soon as they get it. All I paid was shipping one way.

Outstanding customer service is what makes a company a good company!

By the way... I'm shooting a Mossberg 500 Turkey Special with a 20" barrel and 3" chamber...and a Carlson's .680" extended non-ported choke tube. I've had the best ammo patterning results with Dead Coyote and Remington HD in BBs....not to mention good kills.

Good hunting, Bowhunter57

P.S. GC has excellent advise on patterning!
What Dead Coyote load were you using? They told me that the DC choke was designed for the T shot load not the buckshot. Mine said the constriction was .666". I hope that is not too tight for the T shot because that would pretty much make the choke worthless for their shells since T is the smallest size.
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  #9  
Old 01-13-2012, 04:28 PM
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Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by WV Sendero
What Dead Coyote load were you using? They told me that the DC choke was designed for the T shot load not the buckshot. Mine said the constriction was .666". I hope that is not too tight for the T shot because that would pretty much make the choke worthless for their shells since T is the smallest size.
WV Sendero,
The Dead Coyote load that I purchased is T shot. T shot can be difficult to produce a tight pattern, with too tight of a restriction. That was one of the reasons Shane Carlson recommended me returning the Dead Coyote choke tube and exchanging it for a .680" restriction. (No Charge)

I used my dial calipers to measure the Dead Coyote choke tube and got a .660" restriction measurement. Shane Carlson agreed that is the correct measurement, for that choke tube.

I have yet to pattern the .680" choke tube that Carlson's sent me, but I've been hunting with it and it's got killing potiential well past 40 yards.

In my other shotgun, that I use for goose hunting, I use BBBs. Anything larger was nearly impossible to get a decent long range pattern. My goose shotgun is a Russian Baikal with a 24" barrel and a Terror .685" restriction extended non-ported choke tube. Using Kent Fast Steel in BBBs at 1550 f.p.s. with the Terror choke tube, it produces a 91% pattern inside a 30" circle at 40 yards.
That's the technical info...the hunting info is that it's a goose slaying machine!
I have shot geese at 55+ yards that were bang-flopped.

A good choke with the correct ammo is priceless.
Hope this helps!
Bowhunter57
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  #10  
Old 01-13-2012, 10:49 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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Posts: 169
Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowhunter57 View Post
WV Sendero,
The Dead Coyote load that I purchased is T shot. T shot can be difficult to produce a tight pattern, with too tight of a restriction. That was one of the reasons Shane Carlson recommended me returning the Dead Coyote choke tube and exchanging it for a .680" restriction. (No Charge)

I used my dial calipers to measure the Dead Coyote choke tube and got a .660" restriction measurement. Shane Carlson agreed that is the correct measurement, for that choke tube.

I have yet to pattern the .680" choke tube that Carlson's sent me, but I've been hunting with it and it's got killing potiential well past 40 yards.

In my other shotgun, that I use for goose hunting, I use BBBs. Anything larger was nearly impossible to get a decent long range pattern. My goose shotgun is a Russian Baikal with a 24" barrel and a Terror .685" restriction extended non-ported choke tube. Using Kent Fast Steel in BBBs at 1550 f.p.s. with the Terror choke tube, it produces a 91% pattern inside a 30" circle at 40 yards.
That's the technical info...the hunting info is that it's a goose slaying machine!
I have shot geese at 55+ yards that were bang-flopped.

A good choke with the correct ammo is priceless.
Hope this helps!
Bowhunter57
Thanks for the info. Thats a bit annoying that they even made that choke to suit that load if there is a better choke for the job. Like I said before, when I emailed them they said the DC choke was specifically for the T shot. I wish I would have saved the email so I could forward it to you. I need to try to pattern the T shot with that choke and if I have the same problems you did then I will contact them. It at least sounds like their support was good when dealing with you. Thanks again for the info, and when I get a chance I'll pattern the load in my gun with the DC choke and post an update.
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  #11  
Old 01-15-2012, 02:44 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 169
Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowhunter57 View Post
WV Sendero,
The Dead Coyote load that I purchased is T shot. T shot can be difficult to produce a tight pattern, with too tight of a restriction. That was one of the reasons Shane Carlson recommended me returning the Dead Coyote choke tube and exchanging it for a .680" restriction. (No Charge)

I used my dial calipers to measure the Dead Coyote choke tube and got a .660" restriction measurement. Shane Carlson agreed that is the correct measurement, for that choke tube.

I have yet to pattern the .680" choke tube that Carlson's sent me, but I've been hunting with it and it's got killing potiential well past 40 yards.

In my other shotgun, that I use for goose hunting, I use BBBs. Anything larger was nearly impossible to get a decent long range pattern. My goose shotgun is a Russian Baikal with a 24" barrel and a Terror .685" restriction extended non-ported choke tube. Using Kent Fast Steel in BBBs at 1550 f.p.s. with the Terror choke tube, it produces a 91% pattern inside a 30" circle at 40 yards.
That's the technical info...the hunting info is that it's a goose slaying machine!
I have shot geese at 55+ yards that were bang-flopped.

A good choke with the correct ammo is priceless.
Hope this helps!
Bowhunter57
I got out to shoot with the DC load (3.5" T) and the DC choke today and I'm not real sure what to think. I shot at 20, 30, 40, 45. At 20 and 30 it would be really ugly for whatever it hits. Patterns at those ranges were very tight. When I shot 40 and 45 the pattern opened up quite a bit. I was shooting at a 12" diameter circle and at 40yds. it put 20 shot in it and at 45yds. it put 17 shot in it. What do you think of that pattern? Do you think the .680" would do better or is that good at that range? Also, what is that 680" choke called? Was it one of their waterfowl chokes or did they come out with another version of the DC choke?
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  #12  
Old 01-15-2012, 10:48 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: N.W. Ohio
Posts: 185
Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by WV Sendero
I was shooting at a 12" diameter circle and at 40yds. it put 20 shot in it and at 45yds. it put 17 shot in it. What do you think of that pattern? Do you think the .680" would do better or is that good at that range? Also, what is that 680" choke called? Was it one of their waterfowl chokes or did they come out with another version of the DC choke?
WV Sendero,
Shane Carlson would be better to ask the question about pattern density. He might have a different opinion since you're using 3.5" ammo and I was using 3" ammo. However, that don't sound bad. Waterfowlers' standard is with a 30" circle and predator hunters' standard is with a 10" circle...at the distance you intend to hunt.


If you won't shoot a coyote past 45 yards, you're in business. I wanted a killing pattern at 50+ yards, for coyotes, with as many pellets in the circle as I could get. Granted I've not pattened this choke tube yet, but I've called a few feral cats and as hard as they can be to put down...they went down like a plate target. I'm just getting back to work (surgery related) and hope to get back in the field to call some coyotes and test this choke tube's killing power on them.


As for what the choke tube that I have is called...I have no idea, other than what Shane Carlson recommended in its' restriction being .680". The DC choke being a .660", in my opinion, would be more of a turkey choke tube and meant for smaller shot sizes...like #4, #5 or #6. To answer your question: Yes, I think the .680" restriction will perform better. Especially, for larger shot sizes like Ts and/or for alloy shot types like Hevi-Shot, Remington HD, etc.


This is getting long winded, but...


The way the extended non-ported choke tubes were explained to me was that their extended parallel section and gradual tapered cones was what gave them their increased performance. The choke tube should start with a gradual taper to the desired restriction, then the parallel section is designed to collect the pellets and allow them a short time to stop "bouncing" off of each other, so that the pattern stays together after it leaves the muzzle. The engineering designs of a choke tube is what makes it do what it do. ...and Carlson's is one of many companys that is at the top of the game/market.


Hope this helps!
Bowhunter57
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  #13  
Old 01-16-2012, 08:21 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 169
Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowhunter57 View Post
WV Sendero,
Shane Carlson would be better to ask the question about pattern density. He might have a different opinion since you're using 3.5" ammo and I was using 3" ammo. However, that don't sound bad. Waterfowlers' standard is with a 30" circle and predator hunters' standard is with a 10" circle...at the distance you intend to hunt.


If you won't shoot a coyote past 45 yards, you're in business. I wanted a killing pattern at 50+ yards, for coyotes, with as many pellets in the circle as I could get. Granted I've not pattened this choke tube yet, but I've called a few feral cats and as hard as they can be to put down...they went down like a plate target. I'm just getting back to work (surgery related) and hope to get back in the field to call some coyotes and test this choke tube's killing power on them.


As for what the choke tube that I have is called...I have no idea, other than what Shane Carlson recommended in its' restriction being .680". The DC choke being a .660", in my opinion, would be more of a turkey choke tube and meant for smaller shot sizes...like #4, #5 or #6. To answer your question: Yes, I think the .680" restriction will perform better. Especially, for larger shot sizes like Ts and/or for alloy shot types like Hevi-Shot, Remington HD, etc.


This is getting long winded, but...


The way the extended non-ported choke tubes were explained to me was that their extended parallel section and gradual tapered cones was what gave them their increased performance. The choke tube should start with a gradual taper to the desired restriction, then the parallel section is designed to collect the pellets and allow them a short time to stop "bouncing" off of each other, so that the pattern stays together after it leaves the muzzle. The engineering designs of a choke tube is what makes it do what it do. ...and Carlson's is one of many companys that is at the top of the game/market.


Hope this helps!
Bowhunter57
I think I may try a few other chokes based on what you said. I agree with you it does seem more like a turkey choke. It just concerns me that the patterns were not uniform at 40 and 45 even though I had shot on target. I just don't feel like it would be consistent there after seeing the pattern open as much as it did in just 10 yards. Man, inside of 30 it would have to hammer everything it hits. I just would like to get a bit more range and have some uniformity out about 50-60 yards. I think I will get another choke and try that load again and also some 00 buck Federals that I have. I appreciate all of your input and I will continue to update you on what I decide to do and how it works.
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  #14  
Old 01-18-2012, 01:56 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 169
Re: Long Range Shotgun for Coyotes

I did some more testing today with the 3.5" DC T and a full choke that measured .705" with my calipers. This was the factory Invector Plus full that came with my Maxus. Patterns were a bit wider at 20yds (which I wanted) and at 45 yards I got 19, then 22 shot in a 12" circle with the DC choke I only got 17 so I considered a 5 shot gain at that distance to be pretty good. The pattern with the .705" was much more uniform. Another thing I noticed is that with this choke I could hold dead on but with my DC choke I had to hold low left. As of now I'm going to use the full choke until I can test something that is close to the .680" Bowhunter57 suggested.
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