Long Range Hunting Online Magazine


Go Back   Long Range Hunting Online Magazine > Magazine Articles > Technical Articles - Discussion


Reply

What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-04-2009, 06:40 PM
Administrator
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 967
What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

This is a thread for discussion of the article, What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz. Here you can ask questions or make comments about the article.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-05-2009, 11:26 AM
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 156
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADMIN View Post
This is a thread for discussion of the article, What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz. Here you can ask questions or make comments about the article.
Bryan, great article, I agree with what you have to say, Thanks for taking the time to provide something for us to read! Ron Tilley
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-05-2009, 09:31 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MN
Posts: 1,219
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

Wow, that was a technical based article. Now I will admit to being a little intimidated by the knowledge base that the author obviously had, but I'm going to challenge some of what he said.

If I understood correctly he said that a moderate 7mm will push a heavy weight bullet as fast as a Very large mag 30 cal will push a heavyweight bullet. And he said that the BC of the heavy 7mm and the heavy 30 are "vertually" the same.

He also conceded that the 190 class 30 is comparable to the 168 class 284. I looked at the WSM's and the 7 pushing a 168 is going around 50 or so fps slower than the 300 will push a 190 according to Hodgdon's data (rough numbers of course but the point is that the 30 will push it slightly faster). I beleive this makes sense because of the PSI and the surface area that the respective bullets have. larger surface area and same weight = higher veleocity. Simply put, taking a 30 cal and a 284 cal in terms of Pounds per square inch the 7mm will require to be multiplied by 1.18 to equal the square inches of the .308.

It is true that the 190 is heavier than the 168 also, but you only have to multiply the 168 by 1.13 to equal the 190. SO... if my rough math is right then the 30 cal will always have a slight advantage over the 7mm due to the fact that the increase in surface area being pushed increased faster than the weight of the bullet (in this class).

ALSO, if you consider that the 190 has a higer BC than the 168 (@.53 to 49 respectively).

HOWEVER, and a big "however" that is... Recoil is a major issue and I will definately concede that the smaller 6.5 and even the 7mm's give up small amounts of BC to reduce large amounts of recoil.

VERY Cool article and a good brain teezer (hopefully I was somewhat close in my figures otherwise I'll have to stick my tail between my legs and run home lol!)
__________________
I used to re-load but now I "hand-load".
-- Well, at least I try --
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-05-2009, 10:33 PM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: MN
Posts: 1,219
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

upon further reflection, There must be something I'm missing or over simplifying because you can not dispute the fact that a 260 rem shooting a 140 grain bullet will hold the same tradjectory as a 300 win mag and a 190 smk. Same BC and same velocity. Much smaller bullet and smaller case.... Man! I hate being wrong! LOL
__________________
I used to re-load but now I "hand-load".
-- Well, at least I try --
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-05-2009, 11:30 PM
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Idaho Falls, Idaho
Posts: 538
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

Yeah, and the 6.5x.284 pushes it even faster meaning a higher BC. Kind of makes sense as to why they are so popular.

Very good article, I have to read it a few more times to understand it all especially the big "techical" words.

I'm learning more every day....


Dan
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-05-2009, 11:42 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 20
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

Thanks for the article it was an excellent read and very informative thank you,
I wonder if it is not just down to the ballistics,is it because behind us down the track aways people would use a hunting calibre for long range target shooting,the smaller calibres you talk about indeed have the energy to hit a target,whether it be a balloon or paper or steel gong,however they can't match the Killing energy at those long long ranges of the 7mm and 30 calibres in a genuine hunting environment,They don't need the energy and so have developed smalller lighter recoiling calibres for their purpose.
Regards.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-06-2009, 08:13 AM
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Potomac River
Posts: 5,057
Re: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz

I enjoyed your discussion of the 30 caliber bullets, especially the big freight train 240SMK. I ran a large number of calculations on the bullet fired from a 30-378 versus the 7 AM with the 200 grain Wildcat. The only thing you could say about the 240 SMK was it had 20% more weight when it landed but it was a dog in the air. My decision to go with the 7AM was what you said about recoil, I am just not one of the people who like to lie awake at night with a bruised shoulder and even a 308 will do that to you after 50-60 rounds.


The only important question I have is now that we know that you know what we know, what are you going to do about it? Can we expect Berger to bring out a high BC 250-250 gr bullet? And will it with stand a muzzle velocity that will make it useful at long range?


I did not know you were the national Palma Champion, may be you can give me some help so my daughter doesn't beat me so often.
__________________
The Smokin Fur Rifle Club
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads for: What's Wrong With .30 Caliber? By Bryan Litz
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Berger Bullets' Move To The G7 Standard BC By Bryan Litz ADMIN Technical Articles - Discussion 24 03-27-2012 11:26 AM
Buy Bryan Litz' New Book - Applied Ballistics For Long Range Shooting, 2nd Edition Len Backus General Discussion 0 05-10-2011 01:13 PM
Bryan Litz Or Any One That Knows jwp475 Rifles, Bullets, Barrels and Ballistics 10 04-12-2011 07:18 AM
Applied Ballistics For Long Range Shooting By Bryan Litz ADMIN Technical Articles - Discussion 5 08-17-2009 06:56 PM
Bryan Litz joins Berger Bullets Eric Stecker Reloading 22 11-25-2008 08:41 PM

Current Poll
Do you archery hunt for elk?
YES - 29.75%
47 Votes
NO - 55.06%
87 Votes
Not yet, but I plan to. - 15.19%
24 Votes
Total Votes: 158
You may not vote on this poll.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Management Powered by vBadvanced CMPS
All content ©2010-2014 Long Range Hunting, LLC