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H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

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Unread 12-04-2013, 08:13 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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Re: H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

Tested the first loads yesterday 140vld's .020 off the lands over 4831 - 49.5 , 51. & 52.5 the 49.5 averaging only 2724 had the best groups but all had ES over 100. Tried Rem 9 1/2 and Fed 210, I had cleaned the gun before going out. I shot 6 foul shots before starting. All groups were over 1 inch starting with the 49.5 (two groups each primer) both 4 shots with 2 touching and 1 at about 1/2 inch and one over one inch. The rest got bigger as I went. with the 52.5 being 1 1/2" plus and avg of 2910 and starting to show a little exractor marks. I allowed cool down time with each. BTW the gun is a savage 111 with 26 onch barrell and 8 twist. Wind was 5mph and 75 degrees. Not sure what is wrong but was not what I was hoping for.
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Unread 12-04-2013, 08:35 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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Re: H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

Both of my 6.5x284's shoot both H4831sc and Retumbo, with a 100 FPS advantage with Retumbo out of my 24/26" barrels using both Berger and JLK 140 VLD's. Both of my rifles have an accuracy and ES sweet spot .075" off the lands, and give best results with 210M primers but at the cost if 3O-40FPS over the 215's. My standard is 6" groups or less at 1000 yards for hunting accuracy, and 1000FP which gives the advantage to my Retumbo(57.5gr) load at 2970FPS.

"Let us speak courteously, deal fairly, and keep ourselves armed and ready"-T. Roosevelt
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Unread 12-04-2013, 12:30 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The rifle range, or archery range or behind the computer in Alaska
Posts: 3,830
Re: H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

If you're getting large extreme spreads you're doing something wrong. Could be a bad chrony or improper set up, inconsistent neck tension, an inconsistent powder scale or a combination of these.

Some rifles just will not tolerate VLD jump. Yours may just be the case. Try the 140 Amax. They can be sensitive but not nearly as sensitive. Also look at the 142smk for accuracy. You may still have to play with seating depths with all of them but don't let one test session discourage you. It takes time.
Long range shooting is a process that ends with a result. Once you start to focus on the result (how bad your last shot was, how big the group is going to be, what your buck will score, what your match score is, what place you are in...) then you loose the capacity to focus on the process.
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Unread 12-04-2013, 03:23 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 405
Re: H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

Here is some good info on getting the Berger VLDs to shoot

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a target competition shooter who does not worry about jamming a bullet:

.010 into (touching) the lands (jam) 6 rounds
.040 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
.080 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
.120 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a hunter (pulling a bullet out of the case with your rifling while in the field can be a hunt ending event which must be avoided) or a competition shooter who worries about pulling a bullet during a match:

.010 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
.050 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
.090 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
.130 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Shoot 2 (separate) 3 shot groups in fair conditions to see how they group. The remarkable reality of this test is that one of these 4 COALs will outperform the other three by a considerable margin. Once you know which one of these 4 COAL shoots best then you can tweak the COAL towards or away from the lands .002 or .005. Taking the time to set this test up will pay off when you find that your rifle is capable of shooting the VLD bullets very well (even at 100 yards).

Eric Stecker

I would try some bullets that are less sensitive to seating depth as stated in the previous post. Get some SMKs and Amax.

That being said 100 FPS spread is too much and something is wrong. Was this with fireformed brass? As stated before neck tension can do this. Trim and chamfer your brass, clean the inside of the necks with a brush and clean the outside with a little steel wool. Use a good quality lube sparingly and this should get you some consistent tension on those necks.

Make sure that your Chrony is set up at least 10 ft away from the muzzle...sunshades installed.

Every gun that I have seen loves the load that you are shooting.....something isn't right
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Unread 12-04-2013, 06:06 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,206
Re: H870 or H1000 Loads for 65x284 ?

Well all I will say is opinions are like a$$holes, everybody has one, mine is with .020" jump and 49.5grns of 4831, likely short cut, your charge density is crap at less than 85% and the bullets aren't jammed on even touching so you're getting inconsistant start pressures, probably 10-12k psi, on top of that if your loaded round runout is more than .003" that just adds on to the enormous stack of $hit you're dealing with as the bullets are being released at various angles. With atleast .002" neck tension you should never pull a bullet out of the case that is only .010" in the lands, now .040 or .050", that's different. Its going to be hard to get the midrange node with the 24" barrel of the 111lrh, but Greyfox, I believe has the same rifle and does get the node between 2930 and 2970, you must have a 26-28" barrel to get the one at 3040-3070, and a 30-31" to get the top end at 3160-3190. Yeah brass life is only about 7 firings but that's typically half your barrel life with 100 cases so its not that bad. I am a firm believer in the fuller you can get the case the more consistant the round is, with my first 6.5x284 I was on the wagon with everyone else, saying how well Imr4350, H4350, H4831, N160, etc... worked in that particular case, now I don't use anything faster than 7828ssc. 57grns of H1000 with a 215 primer and a Berger touching will also do well. Good luck.
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