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poor grouping

 
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  #1  
Old 06-16-2011, 02:32 AM
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Qld Australia
Posts: 113
poor grouping

A few years ago I bought a Rem 700 VSF in 308. It never grouped well, normally around 1.5-2 inches at 100 yds, so I had it rebarrelled by a reputable barrel maker. The new barrel wouldn't shoot well either at around 1.5 inches with my best reloads. The gunsmith wanted nothing to do with it and said it was just me and there would be nothing wrong with the barrel, but I was not convinced because I had other factory rifles which shot twice as well with half the effort. I then asked another gunsmith for advice and he said the action "looked" fine and it is probably the barrel. I bought a Tikka rifle to replace it and its the most accurate rifle i have ever owned giving consistent .4 inch groups so I decided to go for something a bit different and had the Rem re-rebarrelled to 20BR. Now I have a 20BR that doesn't group! The effort I put into the reloads should be giving me benchrest quality performance, but it doesn't. Experts have told me that blue printing is only fine tuning and wont bring a 1.5 inch group down to .5 inch groups, but surely I haven't had three bad barrels in a row on the same gun.

Has anyone got any ideas other than throwing this gun in the creek?
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  #2  
Old 06-16-2011, 04:22 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: PA
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Re: poor grouping

How is it bedded? Pillars? Scope and mounts tight? Reloads or factory ammo? How are you torquing the action screws and to what weight?
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  #3  
Old 06-16-2011, 04:51 AM
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Qld Australia
Posts: 113
Re: poor grouping

The rfle is fitted with a HS Precision stock, has aluminium pillars, has been glass bedded (twice)and both the scope AND mounts were changed. The scope has also been proven on other rifles. The second barrel which was 7-08Rem gave best results with handloads, with extreme spreads all within 10 fps. factory ammo was way out at around 2-3 inches. The 20 BR handloads are also uniform in velocity with some groups having an ES of 6 fps, but groups still 1 moa. I would be very satisfied with .5 moa. Countless hours have been spent on load combos and seating depths etc with all barrels. Becoming reluctant to keep spending money on this white elephant.

I appreciate you showing an interest.
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  #4  
Old 06-16-2011, 04:54 AM
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Qld Australia
Posts: 113
Re: poor grouping

I forgot to add torque settings of 65in/lbs on the front screw and 35 on the rear, using a fat wheeler wrench.
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  #5  
Old 06-17-2011, 07:25 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 84
Re: poor grouping

I use my calibrated elbow to torque my screws...
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  #6  
Old 06-18-2011, 02:34 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,114
Re: poor grouping

What "reputable barrel maker" are you referring to that fitted one of their barrels that may be a sour one in your rifle?

I've heard folks say things about ER Shaw and McGowen barrels that if put in print, they would burn holes in the paper (or screen if you read it on a computer). Other barrel makers such as Kreiger, Hart, Brux, Border, Shilen, Schneider, Chanlynn, Lilja and Obermeyer do a decent job of fitting one of their own.

40 to 45 inch pounds of torque on the front and back Rem. 7XX action screws is usually about right. Folks have split factory stocks with 60+ inch pounds pulling that round Remmy receiver down into the wood; it works like a splitting wedge in a fire place log. Metal pillars prevent this.

I'd check two things; irregular rifling around the throat and see if the barrel touches the stock anywhere. Rifling should look even and perfect and at least 1/16th inch clearance all around the barrel to the stock.

Last edited by Bart B; 06-18-2011 at 02:39 PM.
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  #7  
Old 07-13-2011, 07:35 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 37
Re: poor grouping

I have a rifle that shot .4"-.5" that went to 1.5"-2" after not being shot for a few months. Drove me nuts until I remembered replacing the action screws with allen heads just before putting it away. The new front screw was touching the bolt's locking lug just slightly. Worth checking out. Sometimes the little things get overlooked. Now that was on a Win 70 but maybe your front screw might be bottoming out on the receiver with an imperceptible amount of movement.

Last edited by ralfus; 07-13-2011 at 07:45 AM.
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