New problem, need expertise!

[Crane]

Maybe I didn't articulate myself correctly because I know Chad's pedigree and his knowledge in this area, as well as many others here, far exceeds mine. I intend to take Chad's advice as soon as I can. Work always gets in the way of the important things.

Thanks for everyone's imput. From what I've been reading this is not an uncommon occurrence which makes it strange that the answer is not more readily understood. I thought I would shoot a factory round fire forming to the new shape load them up and be ready to roll. Maybe the easiest way to accomplish is would be to pull some factory loads then re-seat them into the lands.

[Boss Hoss]

Almost every rifle I have is a wildcat of some sort and requires forming of the brass. Fill the case about 3/4 full of bullseye put some cotton in the top to keep the powder in in the case then fire. Have done thousands upon thousands this way with not one failure--perfect case every time. Learned this trick from Speedy.

[jmason]

Originally Posted by Boss Hoss

Almost every rifle I have is a wildcat of some sort and requires forming of the brass. Fill the case about 3/4 full of bullseye put some cotton in the top to keep the powder in in the case then fire. Have done thousands upon thousands this way with not one failure--perfect case every time. Learned this trick from Speedy.

BH, does the cotton have no ill effect on the barrels? Just curious if it just burns up and leaves nothing behind melted to the bore? I have wondered what to use before to help take up space in the cases.

[Crane]

I've heard the cornmeal method (grits in the south) can erode the throat but I doubt the cotton would have any ill effect. I'm going to buy some new Remington brass today and compare the cotton method vs. long seated bullet vs. other factory rounds.

[Boss Hoss]

Originally Posted by jmason

BH, does the cotton have no ill effect on the barrels? Just curious if it just burns up and leaves nothing behind melted to the bore? I have wondered what to use before to help take up space in the cases.

In a word--no.

[NesikaChad]

One thing I've neglected to mention as I was sorta curious to see if anyone else would comment is/was the plunger ejector that is standard on so many actions. It can be kinda the Achilles heal in all this. Especially with a stock coil spring. It's fun to watch cases ejaculate themselves from a loadng port till a guy starts thinking about how that offset plunger affects a chambered round. That spring loaded little bastage is doing everything it can to keep your case head away from the bolt face and if the chamber is loose enough; the cartridge will wind up cockeyed in the chamber. If I were fire forming I'd consider removing it and manually peeling the fired cases from the loading port until I built up my desired quantity of brass.

If you decide to leave it in, run your neck tension a wee smidge tighter to mitigate the bullet slipping in the case when you rotate the bolt into battery. Keep your loads on the conservative side for the initial "sneezing" and only size enough case to achieve reliable feeding, chambering, and extraction. Again I'd only use a Redding/Wilson die for this.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Chad

[elkaholic]

I've had some experience with the ackley and similar cases in fire forming and I can just about guarantee you that it is caused by a headspace problem. (NOT as a result of the gunsmith) but the fire forming process itself. If you are going to use 25-06 brass and fire form with a bullet seated, you will have to jam it into the lands to keep the case from moving during the firing. This may not work either? The best method would be to use .270 cases and neck them to 25 leaving a (false shoulder) far enough ahead so that the bolt closes stiffly on the case. Don't use a bullet but rather load a small charge of shotgun powder (I use 11 grs of red dot) fill the rest of the case with cream of wheat and top off with a paper plug to hold everything together. You will have to trim the case afterward as the .270 is .046" longer. This will be a benefit anyway as the cases will shrink approx. .015" when forming. i.e. fire forming a 25-06 to form an ackley will cause you to end up with a very short neck (under spec) If they are not properly fire formed, you will separate the cases right ahead of the web after a couple of firings! Another sure fire method is to call Lonnie Hummel at Hornady and have him build you a hydraulic forming die. Hope this helps....Rich