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M98 mauser sleeved action project

 
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  #8  
Old 06-24-2013, 06:51 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

well i have several 7x300 weatherbys on rem actions both with many times that number of rounds. i personaly cant shoot 3/8" groups with them.
but they shoot as good as they ever did for me. ive had a few custom actions
with round bottoms also. while ive never personaly been a 1000 yd competetor ive many friends who are/were including a few record holders. quite a number of whom i hunted with. that topic has never been discussed.
ive never heard of rebedding an action after a hundred or so rounds or even a
1000 rounds. many guys dont even rebed after changing shot out barrels.
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  #9  
Old 06-24-2013, 06:51 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

Eddie, a lot of those round Remmy's shot great scores winning matches and a few would have set records except for a bad shot or two caused by the shooter. Every one of them didn't have many rounds down the barrel and shot that way before barrel torque caused the problem. My first match rifle was a pin driver (more accurate than a tack driver) Rem. 700 in .308 Win. that performed so for about 200 rounds before accuracy degraded. After rebedding, it went back to pin-driving accuracy. . .for another 200 or so rounds.

I thought I made that clear earlier that starting out with a new epoxy bedding job, it took some number or shots fired before the accuracy degradation was noticed. How many rounds did Lt. Carl Kovalchik's .300 Win Mag barrel have through it when that 200-19X record was set back in '96? And was the receiver bare, or was it sleeved?

Gale McMillan sold the US Army team a handful of Rem. 700's with .300 Win. Mag. barrels made by his folks that may have been the most accurate magnums they ever had for long range matches. For several dozen shots, anyway.

One fact about rifle shooting records (group, score, whatever) is, they all happen when all the variables cancel each other out. All the other performances (group, score, whatever) are not as good. The lowest scores and biggest groups happen when all the variables add up gogether. And all the other instances of shooting by that rifle, its ammo and its shooter are not that good. Rarely, if ever does a record setting rifle-ammo-shooter system better the one(s) it already has. Records are at one extreme of performance; worst results are at the other end. Few, if any, benchrest aggregate record holders make public or even remember what the largest group size was in that string of several few-shot groups. But one can reasonably estimate that their largest one was about 50% larger than the agg's average; sometimes a lot bigger. Luck is a partner of group and score shooting; bad luck when performance is poor, good luck when it's record setting.

Last edited by Bart B; 06-24-2013 at 08:57 AM.
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  #10  
Old 06-24-2013, 10:27 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

i would agree with the luck aspect to a point. remember the 1000 yd heavy gun record (10 shots) was held by the same man for about 14 years.
it was shot with a rem 721 action and a 30 cal weatherby type cartridge.
that record was broken only about 3 years ago. id love to have in cash the
dollars worth of ammo shot trying to beat that record over all those years.
when you consider the names of some of the gunsmiths involved building the guns its even more impressive. so in that respect id agree luck plays a roll.
agregate scores are a different situation however in my mind.
when a shooter at a place like williamsport shoots consistantly well enough
to win the year end agregate award thats more than just luck. best groups
or scores for at least 6 out of the 10 matches. nobody is that lucky.
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  #11  
Old 06-25-2013, 05:59 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

BartB, Carl's action was not sleeved and I don't know how many rounds were on the barrel. I will ask Bill O'Rourke when I talk to him today. I have been shooting an unsleeved Rem 722 action in IBS score matches since 1989. I have never rebedded it. Granted, it was a 6PPC for 2 years, a short 308 for several years and has been a 30BR for the last 10 years, so recoil has not been as large a factor as with the 300 Mags. I do, however, re-torque the action screws on a regular basis.
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  #12  
Old 06-25-2013, 10:08 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

well as a result of this conversation i made a call to an old friend and former
williamsport competetor. he had been a year end agregate award winner there twice. he did concur with bart that rebedding with a skim coat is in fact a
practice some shooters use. he knew of one guy who did it for every match.
he seemed to think it might be more widly done in the lighter bench rest classes. wether it actually helps or is another grasping for straws thing
would be hard to say. he did not concurr with bart on the action stiffness issue however. a solid bottom action will out perform an open bottom action period
end of story according to him. it was the sole reason for sleeving actions.
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  #13  
Old 06-26-2013, 06:13 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

BartB, Bill says Carl had about 150 Rds. on that barrel. He shot it because he was saving his other gun/barrel for Perry. So, he goes and sets the record with the new barrel, then shoots it at Perry and wins the Wimbledon Cup. Bill says that they do not re-bed but, they do re-torque before every match.
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  #14  
Old 06-26-2013, 08:07 AM
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Re: M98 mauser sleeved action project

Quote:
Originally Posted by yobuck View Post
. . . . he did not concurr with bart on the action stiffness issue however. a solid bottom action will out perform an open bottom action period end of story according to him. it was the sole reason for sleeving actions.

when a shooter at a place like williamsport shoots consistantly well enough to win the year end agregate award thats more than just luck. best groups or scores for at least 6 out of the 10 matches. nobody is that lucky.
Yobuck, what size circle is the smallest you think a Win. 70 box magazine action based rifle would shoot 40 shots in a row at 600 yards from a .308 Win. or 30 in a row at 1000 from a 30 caliber belted magnum; all shots fired 20 to 30 seconds apart? At least that guy winning those aggs was that lucky. What's the largest and smallest groups sizes in those agg records. I'd like to know what the worst and best perfromance was in them unless it's a secret that's not available except to benchrest insiders.

Eddie, what's the largest and smallest groups sizes in those agg. records you mention? I've never had any benchrester, including some record holders, tell me what the biggest one is, just the smallest one.

One other thing, a benchrester who has the most accurate stuff may not shoot all that well for group or score if he ain't a good wind doper. Many times I know that folk who dope the wind well will outshoot someone using a tack driver but misses the subtle wind changes.

Last edited by Bart B; 06-26-2013 at 09:15 AM.
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