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HELP: Out of Windage - Scope Base Screw Hole Alignment Check?

 
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  #22  
Old 01-06-2013, 12:53 PM
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Re: HELP: Out of Windage - Scope Base Screw Hole Alignment Check?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SidecarFlip View Post
Savage isn't the only manufacturer guilty of sloppy machining, I have a Ruger 22 match target pistol, actually a very tricked up 22-45 bull barreled hunter that the rail mount on the receiver top is drilled lopperjawed. Its so bad, it's actually visible when sighting down the barrel.

It's going back shortly. Its shootable for indoor match but you have to offset the sight (I use a red dot railway sight, no magnification btw) a whole bunch to compensate for the mis alignment. If I get no satisfaction from Ruger, I'll TIG 2 mounting holes shut and jig the receiver and re drill and tap the holes in the correct alignment.

Gary.... Did you get the mill sorted out??
Another reason why I hate the Bridgeport variable speed heads! I got it aligned to within .0003" only to learn that the firicking splindle column and pullets need a complete rebuild with new bushings and drive keys (oversized.). Bridgeport and the clones used a plastic bushing inside them, and these allow the keys to eat up the splines. Male spline shows a little wear, but is salvagable. I'll have to figure out what exact key size to go with. I told him the saddle will probably go one more year tops. Now he's faced with the choice of dumping $2000 in the machine plus new ball screws, or pitching it for something better. But for about $4K I can give him a better machine than Bridgeport ever did.

Now he has a line on a gently used (what he said) K&T MM 600 with the CAT tooling. This machine probably had the "D" series Gemini controll, but might have an Allen Bradley 8200 or 8300 control. Told him a full tilt mechanical rebuild will probably set him back $50K at the most (assuming the spindle is in great shape). I think this one has the flat table top instead of the CNC rotary table that comes built into the X axis slide from the way he described it. In good shape it's a rock solid .0003" machine in two feet of travel. These machines are fairly easy to rebuild, and the worst case thing would be a bad spindle. I can get that all plated and reground up in Muncie. Bearing packs alone will cost close to $2.5K for Barden bearing sets (absolute best made), but think this machine would do fine with MRC or Fafnirs. I've rebuilt two or three MM800's and several MM2200 and MM2300's. They are similar in concept, but much larger. Also a lot more labor intensive. Also told him that he'd better have a long talk with the power company because what he has isn't good enough. I guess he has a line of a steady flow of work out of another company that is good enough to pay for his investment in 18 months. I've heard that one more than a couple times in the past. I told him to plan on a 40 month pay back, unless all his labor and tooling was super cheap. Lastly he's found a nice vintage 3' x 5' cast iron surface plate that he says needs to be touched up. I told him fat chance in hell! I could do it, but it really takes another plate to master off of that's also much larger and has the correct profile for mastering (probably something like a 6' x 9') . Even that way is the incorrect way, but also is the way most folks would do it. The correct way is to have two masters that are well beyond lab grade. I could do it with the six by mine by alternating the areas I master off of (kinda trickey, but do-able). When you start out your rubbing and cutting about five times a day, but as the pattern increases you spend more time cutting. Towards the end you rubbing at best twice a day. And one false pattern may make you start all over (don't ask me how I know!) Be way ahead buying a lab grade 3' x 6' granite table.

gary
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  #23  
Old 01-06-2013, 05:30 PM
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Re: HELP: Out of Windage - Scope Base Screw Hole Alignment Check?

I've never been fond of metal surface plates. I have 2 LSS Pink Granite plates, a checking plate and a toolmakers ledge plate.

The vari speed head is a nice touch and does make spindle speed changes easier but I have the old step pulley heads, except the Haas which has electronic drive. Long as you keep the packs floating in light oil, the old machines stay tight once the proper preload is set. The intermediates on the old step pulley heads like to back out ocassionally, thats about it.

When I spool one up, if it don't spray me with oil, it's running too dry.

Thats probably the one biggest destroyer of machine tools, lack of proper lubrication, especially boundary lubrication on slideways. You work in a shop and you run machines but you don't service them. Maintenance does so service is spotty at best and non existent at worse. I've seen some serious wallowed out and scored ways on machines that were the direct result of poor maintenance practices.

There are no dry slides in my shop. I'm very religious about lubrication, especially boundary lubrication. In my shop, Vactra comes in 5 gallon pails and Velocide in 15 gallon drums.

I'm a grease junkie. I bought a Lincoln air greaser that fits on a 55 gallon drum and 150 feet of grease hose so I can grease my ag equipment everythime I use it and not with cheap clay based grease either. I use a teflon fortified full synthetic HP grease from Lubrication Engineers. It costs plenty but grease is cheap compared to......
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  #24  
Old 01-06-2013, 05:32 PM
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Re: HELP: Out of Windage - Scope Base Screw Hole Alignment Check?

BTW Gary, we hijacked the thread. I apologize for that.
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  #25  
Old 01-06-2013, 09:17 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: greenwood, IN
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Re: HELP: Out of Windage - Scope Base Screw Hole Alignment Check?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SidecarFlip View Post
I've never been fond of metal surface plates. I have 2 LSS Pink Granite plates, a checking plate and a toolmakers ledge plate.

The vari speed head is a nice touch and does make spindle speed changes easier but I have the old step pulley heads, except the Haas which has electronic drive. Long as you keep the packs floating in light oil, the old machines stay tight once the proper preload is set. The intermediates on the old step pulley heads like to back out ocassionally, thats about it.

When I spool one up, if it don't spray me with oil, it's running too dry.

Thats probably the one biggest destroyer of machine tools, lack of proper lubrication, especially boundary lubrication on slideways. You work in a shop and you run machines but you don't service them. Maintenance does so service is spotty at best and non existent at worse. I've seen some serious wallowed out and scored ways on machines that were the direct result of poor maintenance practices.

There are no dry slides in my shop. I'm very religious about lubrication, especially boundary lubrication. In my shop, Vactra comes in 5 gallon pails and Velocide in 15 gallon drums.

I'm a grease junkie. I bought a Lincoln air greaser that fits on a 55 gallon drum and 150 feet of grease hose so I can grease my ag equipment everythime I use it and not with cheap clay based grease either. I use a teflon fortified full synthetic HP grease from Lubrication Engineers. It costs plenty but grease is cheap compared to......
the shop I came out of had oilers that were assigned a set of machines to check. Over a week they would end up checking a hundred or so machines (maybe more), plus they also did the geasing and P.M. as well. Normally they would trade off the grease work, and that had a guy climbing all over a machine. Usually got done on weekends when it was idol. He had a truck that must have had thirty different kinds of grease plus several small grease guns

With todays 10K spindles we've found that too much lube is as bad as not enough. Next to dirt, heat is the killer of ball bearings 80% of the time. Probably the best lube system for ball bearings (high speed setups) was the old spray mist systems (now outlawed) Best setups I ever was around used oil injectors that literally put a drop of oil in a certain location at certain intervals. For way lube, I still prefer the good old Trabon systems. I was always guilty of installing way too many prox switches on lube systems to help a guy trouble shoot a lube fault. They'd bitch about spending an extra six to eight hundred dollars, but never whine when they guy fixed it in minutes instead of hours at $350K an hour. The one that used to drive me nuts was the chill setups for bearing packs. They get a leak in those copper lines, and the pressure is so low that most of the time you can't see or feel it. Hydra Ribs used to scare me to death, but after doing a dozen or so I could do them almost blind folded. Ceramic ball bearing packs still give me the chills, as there's zero room for error. And if you do mess up you just spent a slick $10K. Ever work around silver alloy bearing packs like they use in grinders? They are fairly easy to do, but seem to take forever to get them right.
gary
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