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Trying a new thing - it may suck!

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Old 12-21-2007, 08:39 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Blackfoot, Idaho
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Trying a new thing - it may suck!

Anyone else tried this:

In an attempt to be more prepared for LRH big game I decided to try late evening sniping from a hide.

Been out several times. Yotes have been within visible range both evenings. Obstacles are typical. Russian olive trees/thickets, sage brush and some openings.

Yotes travel the edges and trails.

Tonight is/was a great almost full moon and fresh snow cover. I could only see a spots were things would be visible.

Well after dark, and the shadows were distinct from the moon light the yotes over on the posted ground started yapping. Then the deep voiced yote over in my area opened up. He was less than 500 yds away but I had no good view of the spot due to sage brush.

Scope light transmission is pretty fair. (Weaver Tactical 4.5-14 X 44 FFP Mil Dot). I'd say I could reliably make a shot on a clear snow covered spot out to 300 yds. I gave up when I saw that I was uncomfortable making a shot (reticle blended into background, even on snow) at the 500 yd and 540 yard clearings.

I'm about to make the jump to the best light (seeing through my eyes) transmitting scope I can afford. Either a night force 56mm or a Zeiss Conquest 50mm.

Or should I give up and go kill some yotes the old fashion way.:(
I may be the slowest guy on the mountain . . . . but . . . . I'm on the mountain!
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Old 12-21-2007, 09:10 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,856
Roy I'm guessing that your budget is around $1000 seeing your two options.

Now I'll probably get stoned for saying this but I have never realy been impressed with either the Nightforce or the Conquest scopes low light ability or resolution. I think that their are scopes out their that are brighter and more clear for the same and in some cases less money , granted they will probably not be in the same class as the Nightforce as far as ruggedness goes but I doubt that you'll be using your rig that harshly.
Now if your so scared of your wife (childish attemp at peer pressure) that you won't poney up the funds for a Schmidt & Bender PM 2 which is hands down the brightest clearest scope I have ever looked through , but their only about $2500 on sale:eek: then I would look at the IOR Tactical series , they make a 4-14x50mm with a 35mm tube thats a realy great low light scope for about $900-$1000 , or my second bet would be a Leupold VX-L in 4-14x56mm ,I've only looked through a few of these scopes but they all were very bright and clear.

but most of all you gotta remember that your "hunting" not just shooting , so just like when you find a big buck that only comes to a good shooting lane an hr after dark , you gotta find where hes comming from and setup closer to try to catch him before dark. I've had to do this with my two biggest bow killed bucks , including making a 2hr "creep" only 600yds to my stand which was only 100yds from the thicket that the deer were bedding in. As much as we practice setting up for that 1000yds shot alot of times we have to revert back to being a better stalker than shooter. Same thing goes for the folks that think that Marine snipers are only great shots , shooting is the easy part its the setup thats generaly the hard part.
So just walk in and tell your wife "woman , we are skipping the next 2 or 3 morgage payments so I can get a new scope" then report back with the results of that

Yea it diden't work for me either
Si Vis Pacem Parabellum
Molon Labe
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Old 12-21-2007, 09:46 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Blackfoot, Idaho
Posts: 8,090
Hey, guess what?

The mortgage has been paid off for a couple of years.

Plus that leather sectional couch that was in the living room when I got back from the BB hunt warrants some retribution.;)

I did a side by side test between three scopes in failing light, sun had gone down and the background was mostly snow covered ground and a few buildings.

The nightforce came out the winner for light transmission but had a smaller field of view which was noticeable.

The zeiss conquest came in second but was still very good.

The Leuy VX-III came in third as much behind the Zeiss as the Zeiss was behind the NF.

I'm gonna to the comparison again and throw the Weaver into the mix.

The only reason for pinching pennies is I HAVE TO upgrade the binos also. Found a guy in a world of hurt who wanted 900 for Swaro 10X42s but I'm holding out for 10X50s or is that necessary. I really liked BB's ELs I think?
I may be the slowest guy on the mountain . . . . but . . . . I'm on the mountain!
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Old 12-21-2007, 10:05 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,856
Well if all out brightness is the objective then you might want to look at a fixed power scope as they are all generaly brighter than their variable counterparts , les lenses for the light to get lost in.. Also most of the time with scopes in the same class the higher the power the worse the light transmition will be , this is in direct relation to the size of the exit puipl and thats a factor of obj size tube size and magnification , the higher the power the smaller it gets ,that how a cheaper 2-8 can be a good bit brighter than a 6-18.

Quality of the glass definatly playes a huge part though I don't know whos glass S&B uses but it is the very best I've looked through , my 5-25x56 collects way more light than my eye can alone , I've scanned a field let in the evening with a high 1/2 to 3/4 moon wioth my naked eye and couldent tell if their was anything out their but looking through the scope on 8x I could have made shots on deer out to 300yds ,I would venture to say that it borders on generation 1 night vision for nigh shooting just alot clearer.

I have never been to up on the Conquest scopes , I just never saw that they were any better than Leupolds and Nikons costing 50%-75% less.
Si Vis Pacem Parabellum
Molon Labe
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Old 12-27-2007, 03:52 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Back in the south -NW FL..
Posts: 1,142
Howdy Roy ,

Sounds like a neat undertaking -night sniping coyotes .

I'm going to have to disagree w/ James as bad as i hate to .

I have did side by side test w/a 4.5x14 -50 leupold vxIII and a 4.5x14-44 zeiss conquest and 5.5x16.5 nikon monarch ,the zeiss conquest was very close to the 50mm leupold -trounced the nikon and had far better resolution than both the leupold and nikon.
The leupold and nikon were pretty close on resolution.

For the money -$699 for a 6.5x20-50 the zeiss conquest is a bargain.
I'm going to give the 4.5x14-50 zeiss w/a rapid Z reticle a whirl , predators just don't give a guy a lot of time on shots -so i'm hoping to be able to speed up the time involved in getting off a shot.
You can still use the turrets if you want -so what's to lose.

Well good luck -Mike
AIPAC for president !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 12-27-2007, 06:51 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: OK
Posts: 2,145
Roy, I used to do alot of night hunting, you only need one cartrige per stand. The biggest hurdle is finding the coyote after you shoot it, The muzzle flash off that Allen mag is going to blind you til morning.

That was one problem I had with night shooting, and that was with a .243.

I called at night, so shots were not extended. The cheap scopes I used at the time were always on there lowest settings to gather the most light.

If I were to pursue them during full moons I think I would go with some type of illuminated reticle, I completely understand the reticle "blending" you mention.

A good alternative to doing this at night is doing it at the mornings first light. I had much more success stand hunting in known areas of activity at first light. I know it's early and you'd rather be in bed!

I used to have good luck hunting the mid-morning period by driving around and spotting with glass,then making a stalk that involved getting ahead of there direction of travel, and setting up an ambush, and possibly call. With the ever increasing pressure on the coyotes this tactic has become less efective than it was 10 years ago.

Good luck with the mutts,
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