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Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

 
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  #15  
Old 03-02-2010, 12:43 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kodiak, Ak
Posts: 357
Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

Pitbull

SO sorry you have such a powerful axe to grind. Maybe you can post a picture of one of Kirby's brakes so we can all see the similarities.



Now this brake idea came about in 91 or 92 by a machinst friend of mine who made one and only one for a 50BMG. In 1998 I had all the brakes in my hand. They made and installed a brake. SHot the gun in which the concussion cleared everything from the table including hats and hearing protection. Ears rang for several days! SO back to the drawing board. The next brake was designed with the first port closest to the shooter set at a 90 degree to the bore to shear off the back blast from the four other ports which were set at 35 degrees to the rear.

1. I have never made a brake one, like pictured in any of these photo's.

2. I have a friend that has a program in which I asked him to scale down a Barrett 50BMG brake to fit my handcannon application. Requirements were representative of the brakes sitting on the shelf in my friends shop.

3. I sent the original and other cad drawings to Jim See who has had and installed Kirby's brakes. He tells me that there is no comparison!

4. I purchased a couple of Kirby's brakes,Hollands brakes and a number of other manufacturers brakes along with a $225. Barrett brake and had all sent to the shop (Different friend)in Idaho where they were all tested on my 338 X378 handgun. The report was- Very Severe backblast on short barrels. He did like the Holland brake. It is currently being used as is Kirby's big pain killer brake on 338 X 378 Improved rifles.

5. SInce I have never had one of Kirby's brakes in my hand it would be really hard for me to duplicate it. I can very easily prove what I have said to be true.

I am told that the inside of the muscle brake is where the major difference is from other brakes. I would not know as besides my own made brakes, Vias and Scott Nulls brakes and one Holland quick discharge I have never seen or used another brake. SO if you are crying foul? If I have never made one. If I have never had one in my hand? How is it you are calling me a copycat?? OH, forgot something, I pay for the brakes and their installation just like everyone else.

Hope this helps Pit.

Neal

Last edited by hammertyme; 03-02-2010 at 01:01 AM.
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  #16  
Old 03-02-2010, 07:03 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: OK
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Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

Pitbull, The PK and the Muscle are 2 totally different brakes.

Kirby's brake has baffles that angle back much more agressivly then the 2 angled ports on the Muscle brake. Thats because if you have never noticed He makes some very large custom cartriges that require some pretty extreame recoil reduction. The disadvantage to the extreame angled ports is alot of concussion and blast to the shooters position.

Kirbys brake cosmetically is designed around those angled ports, thus the squared off look on the barrel side of the brake.

The Muscle brake is designed to shear off the blast and concussion from the shooter. and it works like no other brake out there in this regaurd. Shoot the two side by side and the difference is night and day.

I'll give you the fact that Kirbys brake has the ability to reduce recoil more than the Muscle brake. But I didn't work with Neal to design the most efficent brake, I worked with him to come up with an EFFECTIVE brake that is COMFORTABLE for the shooter in EVERY regaurd, and cosmetically looks pleasing to MY EYE, that being the most important part of the Muscle brake and why when it is finished looks like the above picture Neal was so kind to post.

Now in your simplistic aproach to this thread, you think some one copied someone else product based on what?
that both brakes are designed to screw on a barrel?
that the brake has holes in both ends?
that one side is threaded?
that the brake has two flat sides? ((shameless plug) the 3 port and new mini muscle brake are both available without flats to accomidate large dia. barrels)
So please explain the similarities

Last edited by Coyboy; 03-02-2010 at 07:11 PM.
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  #17  
Old 03-02-2010, 07:19 PM
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Location: OK
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Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

Quote:
Originally Posted by pitbull320 View Post
so now with the top ports it is a full blown copy of kirby's painkiller
Nice assumption, The "top ports" in the Muscle brake are not round center holes like the small PK, they are slots coming in from the sides, basically a wrap around extension of the side port rolling over the top. These werre introduced to reduce muzzle flip on 7lb. handguns with a center grip. I have not used them on any rifles because muzzle flip has not yet been an issue with this brake on rifles.
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  #18  
Old 03-02-2010, 11:52 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 153
Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

I have to say it looks very close to me the only thing that looks different is the rear port on the muscle brake is straight and the painkiller is angeled and the painkiller has the ports in the top and that's it.

My next question is how long doe's it take to make a brake the one post says you started in 1992 almost 20 years to make a muzzle brake that seems a little long to me and especially not to see or hear of it until this past year and correct me if I'm wrong but in a previous post on the muscle brake even Kirby made a comment on it.

I'm not try to grind an axe it just looks very close and it interests me on how it come about I have Kirby's painkiller and I have friends that have your muscle brake and next to each other they look the same to me
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  #19  
Old 03-03-2010, 08:40 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

pitbull,
what difference does it make. might want to get off your high horse, sit back and relax. might learn a thing or two.
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  #20  
Old 03-03-2010, 10:31 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kodiak, Ak
Posts: 357
Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

Sometimes we get caught up in an idea whether it be from loyalty (good) or we take something way to far and we find ourselves in a position without support and we start grasping at straws. This thread was highjacked from the original intent of me just sharing the joy of painlessly being able to shoot these very large calibers without getting headaches from the back blast. I do what I do for my own needs and seldom get to share the mind set of what goes into my projects. But at this point I say okay. The brake concept came about when Barrett first did their brake concept. Two guys (one my friend) said hey lets make a bullpup version with an 18" barrel. Since it was done under a company perspectous they worked in the shop and also in my friends personal shop at night. One gun was made and apparently was marketed. Several proto-type brakes were made. They ended up going with the Barrett and never made another brake!! Below is a picture of the Barrett on my 460 X 510 handgun.

I called friends who make brakes all over the country for their opinion of what brake I should put on ELE. Several including Ron Bartlett at Vias said Barrett without a doubt was the best recoil reducing system on the market. AFter shooting ELE a bunch I new that I had to go another route or sell the gun.

Now look at the Barrett Arrowhead brake in the picture. Think in terms of semetry. When you apply the arrowhead into a cad program and with my instructions to my friend the cad programmer and reduce the Barrett you get an exact representation of what Kirby's brake looks like! That can't be I said because the back rake of the ports wasn't need at 35 or so degrees. Did not like the square back and the absolute inability to radius the brake into the barrel diameter.
It is pretty obvious to those that want to see the differences what those difference are! As Jim said, nothing the same about the two be it inside or out. Including the NO top port system AND the top port system! Not even the top porting system looks like either Darryl Holland or Kirby's.



Now lets look at the top porting which even with the third generation looks nothing like Kirby's or Daryl's.



It has been fun and have really enjoyed sharing with you pitbull. For the most part Jim and a very few others have heard this story. I will say that my 90 degree first port concept wasn't mine. But as it set dormant on someone's shelf for 20 years, I am laying claim to it now because it took my headaches away and stopped me eating powder exhaust.

Have a nice day.

Neal

Last edited by hammertyme; 03-03-2010 at 10:43 AM.
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  #21  
Old 03-03-2010, 12:08 PM
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Re: Baby Muscle brake test/ Great American 338

thanks for sharing, Neal. Keep it up, enjoy reading your posts.
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