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What causes horizontal and vertical strings

 
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  #8  
Old 05-09-2011, 09:38 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

It would be nice to shoot a chrono when trying to verify some stringing. I do not have access to one. As far as the sand bags, I have just a sandbag for the front and a bag that was purchased from Walmart for the back, looks like a Caldwell but it probably isn't. I guess I was getting a little to confident as out of the 9 rounds I shot, 3 rounds were well under a moa and a couple more rounds were just over the MOA. I have checked torque on rifle and scope and I do use a torque wrench. I believe the problem is as one of you replied that I need to continue on my technique. The wind did not help me out, but I will work on getting back to basics. Thanks for all of your input.
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  #9  
Old 05-10-2011, 04:58 PM
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Location: Allen, TX
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

Wind would easily account for much of what you're seeing.

It also seems to me like you have too many variables changing to be difinitive.

I suggest you pick the best 2 loads and go back and shoot several groups each.

... ideally using a chronograph with no wind

If one group is consistently vertical, then the velocity ES is one consideration.

If the other group is consistently horizontal, then seating depth/jump is something to consider.

-- richard
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  #10  
Old 05-12-2011, 04:58 PM
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

What some folks are saying about vertical shot stringing in this thread is, IMHO, way off base; probably out of the ball park.

Consider the fact that a .308 Win. has a 2/10ths inch vertical shot stringing at 100 yards for a 100 fps spread in muzzle velocity. And a .300 Win. Mag. shooting 180-gr. spitzer boattails out at about 3000 fps with a 100 fps spread in muzzle velocity has vertical shot stringing at 200 yards of about 6/10ths of an inch. If vertical shot stringing is more than this, there's something else causing it. And a rifle capable of 1/8th MOA groups of the shooter at these ranges is needed to see these effects of a 100 fps spread in muzzle velocity.

Most common problem shouldering a rifle as it rests on something atop a bench is where the butt plate's put in the shoulder; too low and shots go high; too high and shots tend to go lower. In second place is how hard one bears down on the rifle's cheek piece with their own head; too hard and shots go low, too soft and shots go high.

Horizontal shot stringing from rifles so shot is common when the rifle's not pulled back into the shoulder the same way for each shot. There's also a shift in windage zero from sitting at a bench to standing up on your hind ligs; shots to to the right more so when at the bench.

If the rifle's trigger has a really heavy pull, the impact of the trigger finger transferred to the rifle when the sear's released and the finger lever comes to a hard stop is quite a force. If that force is not in line with the bore axis, it'll pull/push the rifle to one side. Good way to see this is dry firing and watch were the scope's reticule moves when the firing pin snaps home. If it jumps left for a right handed shooter, the trigger finger's not far enough onto the finger lever; it pulls back at an angle from right to left. If the trigger finger's too far in, it pulls the rifle to the right moving the recitule that way when the firing pin snaps.

One sure way to have horizontal shot stringing is finger flicking when the round fires. That's when the trigger finger's unconciously told to jump off the trigger's finger lever when the sear releases. You gotta keep that finger on the trigger with it at the stops until the rifle stops moving from recoil. Practice doing this so it's second nature. Finger flickers never shoot very accurate. This is called follow through.

Last edited by Bart B; 05-12-2011 at 08:17 PM.
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  #11  
Old 05-12-2011, 07:18 PM
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

Bart B makes some very good points.

But reallistically, you've got way too many variables changing. You need to try again when there's no wind and establish a baseline.

-- richard
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  #12  
Old 05-12-2011, 09:41 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

Again you guys have very good points. I hope to get some new loads loaded tomorrow and spend spend some time on the range this weekend. Perhaps I will have some good pictures to share. Thanks for your help!
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  #13  
Old 06-13-2011, 01:40 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2011
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

I changed rifles and finally fine tuned some loads in my Sendero 300 wm. After glass bedding it and and sending the scope back to check POI I was able to find a calm morning and did some 510 yard shooting. The group pictured is a 4 shot group at 3 and 3/8 inches. There was the 5th shot that went high and left about six inches from the group, but I'll say I pulled that shot. I think I will leave the load and the rifle alone as I'm not sure I can get any better patterns. This rifle has come a long way from 3 inch groups at 100 yards. I'm using 79 grains of H1000 powder behind Berger 185 grain VLD hunting bullets seated to 3.60 COAL
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  #14  
Old 06-13-2011, 01:56 PM
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Re: What causes horizontal and vertical strings

When you stick with it you can usually figure things out if the rifle is any good in the first place. Good job!......Rich
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