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Using cases as headspace gauges.

 
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  #8  
Old 08-25-2013, 02:10 AM
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

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Originally Posted by wbm View Post
What a bunch of calumnious nonsense.!

Nice wordsmithing! Remind me never to play you at SCRABBLE. At least, not if money is involved...
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  #9  
Old 08-25-2013, 04:48 AM
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

Adjusting headspace on anything except a Savage is not for the gunsmith-wannabe; dismiss it from your mind. Doing this on a Savage is easy - it can be done with a fired case, but a $25 go guage is an absolute must have. You can attach a small sticky dot across the bottom of your go guage, and it becomes a no-go guage. That's about as cheap as it gets.
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  #10  
Old 08-25-2013, 11:15 AM
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

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Originally Posted by Max Heat View Post
What you say does sound like the only 100% "sensiblble" way to go about it. But with all of the switch-barreling going on these days, it seems that many are shortcutting on REAL gauges, not wanting to shell out the money for all of the different calibers that they shoot. Believe it or not, the place where I saw the statement about using fired cases as a gauges is actually an older post located on THIS site (different sub-forum, I think). I won't show the link, and put the poster on the hotseat. But maybe SOMEBODY should educate him though, as his method would cause the HS to continually grow, eventually leading to an unsafe situation.

That being said, the only "bullet proof" method that I would condone, for someone wanting to cheap out on the gauges, would be to properly headspace the firearm using a real gauge, and then running some cases through it until one that EXACTLY mimmics the feel of the gauge is found. Then that case should be clearly marked as a gauge, never-again being, sized, loaded up, or fired.
I know guys that use a case to set their headspace with all the time. Sometimes with a wildcat it's the only way. Now most of these guys are putting a small piece of Scotch Tape on the case head which to me is defeating the idea. In something like a Savage, the barrel is actually pulled forward .003" to .006" when you tighten the nut anyway. I use a Forster gauge most of the time, but not always . (sometimes you simply can't get a gauge). Other times I have made my own (not rocket science). I used to know a couple guys that made their own adjustable ones that were pretty slick.

With my 6/250AI, I use a sized case that headspaces about .0025" to .003" short (on purpose). Tighten the barrel to get a good lockup on the shoulder with the bolt closed of course. Then tighten the nut for about .0045" of forward movement. Never had an issue.
gary
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  #11  
Old 09-14-2013, 07:40 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Remington County, PA
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

I will be coverting my rem 7RUM to barrel-nut configuration (aka - remage) when my new barrel arrives (about 2 months). Since I will be shooting it quite frequently, and I am now a real stickler, when it comes to maintaining nice and tight HS, I would prefer to use a real gauge. I'm thinking of going with Pacific Tool brand, but they are on backorder for about 3 more weeks. I'm wondering how they stack up against the other brands, but I am assuming they are all pretty much equal.

I did have my sav 7RM HS'd a few months ago (before I owned a barrel nut wrench) by a smith for $60 (could have bought the wrench AND a gauge for that), because my primers were really getting flattened, and one even "mushroomed" out of the back of the case. I haven't shot it yet since then, but the fired cases will not even begin to allow bolt closure. I haven't re-sized any of them yet, but I'm assuming they will work when they do get re-sized. Anyways, being that it will not be used very often, I don't think it worth while to invest in a 7RM gauge. But I'd still like to have a means to gauge it occasionally. So I'll be looking for a "cage" (case-based gauge) that has just the right feel, when I finally do get around to re-sizing/loading some cases. And I'm going to hold off on shooting it until that is done. The accuracy of a home-made gauge would be purely dependent on how well it is "calibrated" to the actual gauge, just like a scribed-up bar of steel used for linear measurement will be exactly as accurate as the how accurately the scribe marks were copied over from a machinist's scale.

Last edited by Max Heat; 09-14-2013 at 08:26 AM.
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  #12  
Old 09-14-2013, 10:43 AM
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

My head space measurements are w/respect to MY chambers(not SAAMI, or FL sized cases).
Many chambers hold their own personalities. Their body & shoulders are at slightly unique angles and diameters(affecting datums). Actions certainly have there own personalities as well.
SAAMI,, springback from FL sized,, these are unlikely to present numbers to my chamber & fitting standards.

My go/no-go gauges are used by my barrel finishers, and if I were changing barrels on a Savage I would use them. But normally I use a fully fireformed to fit case(master) for die setting, and once the numbers are logged, from my gizzys, it's very rare that I pull it out again for the same barrel.
Pretty much never for simple bumping(it's in the log).

When I do go to bumping, I pull from a single box for each specific chamber -the body die, a matched shellholder, any special gizzy.
I spin the die down snug(by hand), insert matched shellholder, size a case, measure result with gizzy, and tighten die with a wrench ever so slightly to creep into perfect match per log.
My stuff is set so close that it usually only takes a single tweak to be right on the money, and I don't even need to chamber check it. It's right.
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  #13  
Old 09-14-2013, 01:18 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

I tried the tape on the back of a go gage one time and the bolt smears/tears it up. After that one time I swore I would never do it again.
The way I figure it, gages are cheap and if you can't afford the gages you most likely need to think about a cheaper hobby.
This is just my $.02
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  #14  
Old 09-14-2013, 01:31 PM
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Re: Using cases as headspace gauges.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clay Target Guy View Post
I tried the tape on the back of a go gage one time and the bolt smears/tears it up. After that one time I swore I would never do it again.
The way I figure it, gages are cheap and if you can't afford the gages you most likely need to think about a cheaper hobby.
This is just my $.02
You're not supposed to force the bolt down with your fist....you use finger pressure. Bolt operates on a go gauge....and then wont shut on a go gauge +2 layers of scotch tape ( FINGER pressure)
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